One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[Pirate Queen]

@Pirate Queen
The text is on fanfiction.net, it starts with "3 marines walk into a bar, " hard to not think of it as a joke or an official release.

I think its fanfare, since i couldn't find any reference of it elsewhere, correct me if i am wrong. It also says chapter 3: Zoro, which was the title of the 3rd chapter title, pirate hunter Zoro.
if its fan-fare, then its a decent job, but like you said already, at best its non-canon..

Anyways, thanks for sharing.

There is an offical release. Just the only one I can find was a translation on fanfic, but it is real.

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 26, 2021, Original Post Date: Jan 26, 2021 ---

What if they think Zoro is more impressive because of his killing intent and how he can be intense as opposed to SHanks being laidback and Mihawk being stoic?

It says why they think he's more impressive. Shanks just blocked Akainu. Zoro cut a mountain. They don't realize Shanks feat was more impressive. Their whole perception is twisted.

 

[albertwv]

How are we discussing what 3 low level marines think about who is the strongest swordsman. Let's put an end to this.

 

[XXGenesis]

How are we discussing what 3 low level marines think about who is the strongest swordsman. Let's put an end to this.

It’s non cannon it doesn’t even matter. This is when I start to side eye the mods

 

[M3J]

It’s non cannon it doesn’t even matter. This is when I start to side eye the mods

pervert


But anyway, what we see matters more than what we hear from characters who aren't high-level enough as fighters. Zoro hasn't shown or implied anything to put him on the same level as Mihawk or Shanks while it's implied that Shanks is stronger than Mihawk.

 

[hokageji]

One Piece novel Straw Hat Stories

One Piece novel Straw Hat Stories (Magazine: ONE PIECE novel Straw Hat Crew) is an official novel by Tomohito Ohsaki (大崎 知仁, Ōsaki Tomohito?). Three of the stories—Luffy, Sanji and Robin—were initially published in first three One Piece Magazines volumes. The remaining stories were included when...

onepiece.fandom.com

Well, that's interesting. Thanks for sharing, so looks like it could be canon too.

There is an offical release. Just the only one I can find was a translation on fanfic, but it is real.

Yep, I saw it after my post, i am interested in all their stories but its better to get a proper translation too...

On Zoro's strength, i think him being spoken at the same level as Mihawk itself is a great achievement. However, that itslef isn't proof that Zoro is superior himself.

From 1001, we saw whom Kaido considers at people who can beat him, we didn't see Mihawk there. So this fight will set it up for Zoro to be just behind Mihawk IMO and perhaps at the same level, but who's stronger would only be determined by a fight.

 

[Nie Li]

Well, that's interesting. Thanks for sharing, so looks like it could be canon too.

You're welcome.

Canon or not, it's a realistic scene that could very well happen, but it has zero implications.

Three random marines that don't even know what haki is believe Zoro and Mihawk were equally impressive because they sliced through two big things. However, as readers, we should be smarter than to make a comparison between Zoro and Mihawk based on those two scenes.

On one hand, Mihawk made a casual slash that was aimed at Luffy, who was standing right in front of him, and slashed through a mountain-sized iceberg as collateral damage.

On the other hand, Zoro minced Pica, who was much smaller than the iceberg, from up close and starting off with one of his strongest techniques.

For a random marine it's to be expected that Zoro would look similarly impressive, if not more, but from a reader's perspective? Not a chance.

From 1001, we saw whom Kaido considers at people who can beat him, we didn't see Mihawk there. So this fight will set it up for Zoro to be just behind Mihawk IMO and perhaps at the same level, but who's stronger would only be determined by a fight.

We don't see Rayleigh, Akainu, Big Mom, Garp, Blackbeard or Dragon there, either, so looking that far into it is a mistake. The silhouettes are not proof that people who were not on them don't have the strength to injure, defeat or give Kaido a proper fight, since we even know that Rayleigh has better mastery of the haki that has made Luffy reach that level.

I will avoid getting into the Mihawk and Rayleigh argument, but there being characters such as Rayleigh and Big Mom (who we know for sure can give Kaido a fight) omitted from the panel means that there's no conclusion to be drawn from it unless being purposefuly biased.

The silhouettes are just the first people that came to Kaido's mind, it's possible he hasn't met Mihawk or that he simply left him out because he's not a pirate who's after the same kind of Yonkou/PirateKing greatness those others are after, just like Rayleigh.

 

[fist-of-fury]

What Zoro is to Luffy is what Katakuri is to Linlin.

First mate.

luffy does not seem impressive compared to the rest of the supernovas

 

[Pirate Queen]

luffy does not seem impressive compared to the rest of the supernovas

Lol what?

--- Double Post Merged, Jan 27, 2021, Original Post Date: Jan 27, 2021 ---

Luffy compared to Shanks, WB, Roger, Rocks... but he's the least impressive

 

[hokageji]

looks like fists of fury missed all the spots...

 

[Ramen]

Luffy compared to Shanks, WB, Roger, Rocks... but he's the least impressive

Has to be an analogy to EoS.

 

[LadyVados]

In terms of raw attack power is Zoro no. 1 in the verse ?

 

[M3J]

He is not.

 

[Pirate Queen]

In terms of raw attack power is Zoro no. 1 in the verse ?

Possible but we can't possibly know right now. I would argue its Blackbeard due to his quake fruit or Akainu due to Oda himself acknowledging the Fleet Admirals massive attack power FOR SURE

I would say:
Kaido
Big Mom
Shanks
Dragon
Blackbeard
Luffy
Kidd
Law
Rayleigh
Ben Beckman
Kizaru
Akainu
Aokiji
Fujitora
Garp
Sengoku
Etc
All have greater RAW attack power.

I don't even think he is top 10 right now. But give it 1 arc and thats changes. He might be nearing Mihawk Level right now tho. That is a very real possibility.

 

[Crimson Ice]

In terms of raw attack power is Zoro no. 1 in the verse ?

Is this a joke?

 

[Shasha23]

Possible but we can't possibly know right now. I would argue its Blackbeard due to his quake fruit or Akainu due to Oda himself acknowledging the Fleet Admirals massive attack power FOR SURE

I would say:
Kaido
Big Mom
Shanks
Dragon
Blackbeard
Luffy
Kidd
Law
Rayleigh
Ben Beckman
Kizaru
Akainu
Aokiji
Fujitora
Garp
Sengoku
Etc
All have greater RAW attack power.

I don't even think he is top 10 right now. But give it 1 arc and thats changes. He might be nearing Mihawk Level right now tho. That is a very real possibility.

Dude just this fight has shown you in terms of damage output Zoro is above Luffy, Law and Kid also Luffy has never been above Zoro when it came to attack damage and that will never change.

--- Double Post Merged, Feb 1, 2021, Original Post Date: Feb 1, 2021 ---

In terms of raw attack power is Zoro no. 1 in the verse ?

doubt that since there are a lot of people who also have OHKO attacks in the verse and their powers are more effective than Zoro, but if we just look at the people fighting on top of Onigashima then I would say Zoro is 2nd closest to Kaido when it comes to having a one-hit knock out attack.

 

[XXGenesis]

Comparing Blunt Damage, or Concussive force to Deep Lacerations & Punctures doesn’t make sense. Both inflict pain & damage & both can be more effective or less depending on the circumstances & situation.

No Zoro casually as a swordsman deals high damage but all in All Luffy’s King Kong Gun is more destructive than anything Zoro has done..plus Luffy has inner ryou that’s gonna leavethe place a mess

 

[kkck]

Something I've been wondering about...

The series has kinemon's swordsmanship style as being capable of both generating and cutting flames. Flame generation is a rather common skill (luffy, zoro and sanji have it) but in turn cutting flames is actually a bit extraordinary. For context on why, consider what haki allows against logias. Haki allows users to interact with the substance hidden away by a logia's intangibility. Hence why haki acts as a way to level playfields between ability users. Now, back in WCI we had a reveal though, we saw prometheus was invulnerable to haki attacks. Which in context makes sense since he has no real substance, he is merely flames. The same applies to good old zeus.

Now, we have seen two exceptions to zeus' and prometheus' invulnerability to physical damage on account of them lacking any substance: Brook's ability and then kinemon's swordsmanship. Not via kinemon of course but rather zoro who cut prometheus, and presumably incapacitated him for at least a bit. Brook's ability to cut zeus makes sense within the context of fruit interactions so there is nothing implicitly extraordinary about this. But it is significant when it comes to people whose swordsmanship is unaffected by devil fruits as this is so far unexplained by combat mechanics we are familiar with.

Now, here is what I am thinking. The implication so far is that a swordsman ability to cut through steel, and also to not cut through this, is related to haki. I am thinking kinemon's and zoro's ability to cut through fire is an extension of this. You can basically progress your ability to cut or not cut things to the point where you can actually cut the intangible. Based on kinemon or zoro this would be a particularly rare ability and perhaps the implication is that you have to learn how to cut new intangible things one by one rather than just learning the ability to cut intangibles in general. It'd be interesting if zoro learns to cut other substanceless stuff. Say, he learns how to cut lightning.

 

[Shasha23]

Comparing Blunt Damage, or Concussive force to Deep Lacerations & Punctures doesn’t make sense. Both inflict pain & damage & both can be more effective or less depending on the circumstances & situation.

No Zoro casually as a swordsman deals high damage but all in All Luffy’s King Kong Gun is more destructive than anything Zoro has done..plus Luffy has inner ryou that’s gonna leavethe place a mess

It doesn't matter how one would try and spin it the fact is Zoro's attack have 100% critical damage meaning he only ever needs one clean hit to end a fight while Luffy would need to land hundreds of hit to win a fight, that is not even a close contest, the difference is huge!

Luffy in this fight has been using his strongest form landing his strongest attacks and yet Kaido just brushed them off like nothing, Luffy will need to land hundreds of hits in order to deal any form of meaningful damage to Kaido while on the other hand Zoro can make Kaido dodge with just 1 attack and that wasn't even his strongest attack yet Kaido deemed it dangerous enough to dodge it.

Luffy can have all the khaki and different attacks he wants at the end of the day he still doesn't have the ability to compete with Zoro in terms of attack damage, it has been that way ever since they fought Morgan.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Its great that Luffy is so powerful he doesn't need a weapon to defeat Yonko level characters whereas almost every other top tier besides Garp has been shown to use something other than their fists.

Luffy and Garp really are exceptionally power in that regard.

Luffy doesn't kill people so his fighting style is perfect for the type of King h wants to be.

Even Oda said Luffy wins by defeating his opponents dream. Luffy doesn't have to kill someone to crush someone's dreams and that has served him well (seeing as Crocodile came back and saved his life in marineford)

That being said, you don't see all the damage punching is doing to the body where as with a clean slash you can see the flesh being cut. You can't see broken bones. Concussive damage or internal bleeding.

In One Piece all fighting styles are equally dangerous but swordsmen have the benefit of ending fights quicker unless they are very outmatched. Luffy has defeated weapon users, non weapon users, and df users alike.

 

[Shasha23]

Very true Garp is an exception in this verse, he is the only character who doesn't rely on weapon to beat people unlike characters like Luffy who rely on devil fruit powers in order to be strong or even be a contender.

Its a good thing you're not going to downplay Zoro for having high attack damage than Luffy this truly is a first WOW I'm proud of you!

yeah in One Piece are equally dangerous but not all fighting styles are equal, Luffy has defeated people of different fighting styles up till now with a lot of effort on his part but Dallas if he had even half the damage Zoro can use he would have won easier, to bad he isn't on Zoro's level when it comes to damage output or Kaido would have been done by now considering how many hits he has landed.