Discussion Sanji Discussion Thread

[Lord Traffy Law]

Sanji has already used the raid suit once, after saying he wont use evil science... So i dont see him not using it further. But i would prefer to see him without RS and take down Jack, only using RS in scenarios to be invisible.

Sanji has already used it 3/4 times imo , he had to have used it first before page one , just trying on the suit , he then tested it out a bit on page one, used it to escape X drake/Hawkins and carry Nami and co away and then again on king
Like I said he's past that and willing to use the suit in battle and important situations
Jack just doesn't do it for anyone yeah sanji defeating him would be a feat but jack is like sanji he's been kinda getting his ass handed to him alot as well as seeing how queen/king talk down on him , I dunno is it really that hype for sanji to defeat him ? Going from king/queen matchups to a wounded jack is dissapointing

TBH I simply don't think there are any set matchups yet in the arc. The wano arc is optimistically.... barely 3/5s of the way done, maybe less. In previous arcs we usually get a lot of shenanigans until the final stages of the arc when the final matchups are shown and executives finally start falling. So you have kaido's crew most of whom are zoans.. meaning that even if defeated they can at least be back up fighting within an hour and the fact that there is simply so much ground left to cover. Soon enough the focus should shift from the fights against kaido's crew to actually saving wano from onigashima.

The wano arc in itself is definitely more than 3/5tha done unless you are referring to the climax then I might agree but the climax in it self has 30-36 chapters , wano started arond chapter 908 we are at 1006 essentially. 100 chapters in , we are probably at the 70/75% done part ( which is why I can't see the raid failing it would make it the longest arc in the series by far and it'd too dragged out ) but around 50/60% in regards to the raid climax

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 4, 2021, Original Post Date: Mar 4, 2021 ---

Well GrandLineReviews summarised Sanji perfectly in his latest video, the problem most of us had was that his rivalry with Zoro made us subconsciously compare them in a way that was bad on our part, for me as of now Sanji is just a chivalrous gentleman who is dialled up to 11 and takes his chivalry to the extreme. I really like Sanji as a character since he is more "human" like compared to Luffy and Zoro but the perviness is the problem we all have I think but I really respect the fact that even if it leads to his death he wont hurt a women, ill be the first to argue that this is a detriment in a shounen but the fact that Sanji sticks with it is very impressive.
We should view Sanji more in a comedic light and not as serious as before I think in order to appreciate him even more as a character, I mean didn't we all laugh at what he did and not only that but he is now about to kick some ass and take names which is so different from Zoro who is just a 1 dimensional character

I always push back on this , sanji was just a flat out badass character pre timeskip ,if you compare post and pre timeskip sanji , he just isn't as consistently badass fighter or strategist he was pre timeskip , his defining badass moments are all pre ts so far
Infiltrating the sea train , ruining enels ship , Mr prince and outsmarting crocodile
He had 3 solo cool fights and shone like crazy Vs pacifista and oars
Also willing to drop his life for Luffy ( and zoro ) and issued a threat at the same time
All his best moments like outsmarting
You don't even have to compare him to zoro for him to look lamer , the balance isn't there he is kinda more goofy ( I don't mind but the blood nose saga was embarrassing ) much more actively perverted ( actually peeping at women )

 

[hokageji]

Sanji has already used it 3/4 times imo , he had to have used it first before page one , just trying on the suit , he then tested it out a bit on page one, used it to escape X drake/Hawkins and carry Nami and co away and then again on king
Like I said he's past that and willing to use the suit in battle and important situations
Jack just doesn't do it for anyone yeah sanji defeating him would be a feat but jack is like sanji he's been kinda getting his ass handed to him alot as well as seeing how queen/king talk down on him , I dunno is it really that hype for sanji to defeat him ? Going from king/queen matchups to a wounded jack is dissapointing

Disappointing? Sure, as a reader and you are within your rights to be disappointed at the story development. But who will save the scabbards? Who will save Momo? Someone has to. Zoro and Luffy have their hands full and Jinbei is busy as well. No one else is strong enough to stop Jack, Sanji is the only one who can.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 4, 2021, Original Post Date: Mar 4, 2021 ---

Sanji has already used it 3/4 times imo , he had to have used it first before page one , just trying on the suit , he then tested it out a bit on page one, used it to escape X drake/Hawkins and carry Nami and co away and then again on king
Like I said he's past that and willing to use the suit in battle and important situations
Jack just doesn't do it for anyone yeah sanji defeating him would be a feat but jack is like sanji he's been kinda getting his ass handed to him alot as well as seeing how queen/king talk down on him , I dunno is it really that hype for sanji to defeat him ? Going from king/queen matchups to a wounded jack is dissapointing

Great moments dont necessarily come in battle alone. Sure, we have Zoro fans who will underplay Sanji but they are also the same fans who think Zoro > Luffy and Zoro will kill Kaido. For such people, even if Sanji takes down Queen or King, it wont be enough.

Why are we suddenly undermining Jack? I dont get it. Jack has always bounced back and fought again. He fought both Dog and Cat for multiple days albeit not in their Sulong form, recovered an island hitting him, a huge slash by Doji and still walked around. We know that zoans have incredible resilience and stamina, and from Impel Down, awakened ones are even further. So by that, Jack may well be close to 100%.

 

[XXGenesis]

I think the seriesous questions are .Is it ok, how Oda has handled Sanji’s character? Did Sanji’s quality as a character drop? Or are Fans spoiled and don’t know wtf they are talking about ?

These are the serious question I would like to ask hardcore Sanji fans. Because I haven’t liked Sanji in between my opinion of poor portrayals and over zealous fans trying to sell me B.S....His gags are over the top, he hasn’t been given good combat portals or much of it, his handicap against women is being looked at as pathetic giving the situation, his perversion has been amped up.

 

[kkck]

Spoiled fans? Spoiled by what? Memories of a better character? If oda is writing something the fans don't like then the problem isn't the fans, it's oda.

 

[Franckie]

Sanji I never particularly cared for. His gags are boring and his "chivalry" toward the ladies is annoying. The only time I was ever interested in his character post-timeskip was during the Whole Cake Island Arc when his background was expanded upon.

 

[M3J]

Sanji has definitely declined in terms of quality character. The nosebleed gag got old after the third time, and Sanji hasn't had much to do.

 

[kkck]

I really can't understand anyone who says sanji hasn't been grossly mishandled. His biggest contribution during the "year of sanji" was baking a fucking cake. It was THAT bad. Nothing else of consequence happened sanji wise, definitely not something that could possibly offset so much stock being placed on that fucking stupid cake. And things haven't exactly improved since then.

 

[hokageji]

I agree about the disappointment with Sanji till Wano arc atleast. The problem with Sanji's development till then is that he got the most coverage for a strawhat other than Luffy and yet didnt get a decent match. Once the cake was baked, we saw him move at high speed against Oven but all that left us with a disappointment for further fights. We cannot complain about Sanji not getting coverage, only about Sanji not being represented in a strong manner. This oculd do with Jinbei being in the mix, but nevertheless wasn't enough.

But i dont agree, or atleast dont feel the most recent events have shown him unfairly. At any given stage, Sanji will not him woman. We know that, we can expect that and we know he will come out worse than that. Oda did a great job representing it hte previous chapter too, only the strawhats understood his problem whereas the rest of them voiced their opinions like the fans of the show. But to expect Sanji to hit a woman is ridiculous. I am looking to see what else could he have done?

THe only thing i can think of is using Diable Jamble to escape the spider nets. Brooks mentioned it in Thriller bark that burning them would release and thats what Franky did. Maybe if Sanji had escaped in that fashion, it would've been a better representation but it would've done injustice to Black Maria as a character. Black Maria needed a build up to fight Robin, the 5th strongest easily in the strawhat crew. Sanji needing to be saved was a nice way and if we ignore how he's been shown post Dressrosa till now, i wouldn't complain about that. All issues with Sanji are limited to that point for me, not since.

 

[M3J]

I agree about the disappointment with Sanji till Wano arc atleast. The problem with Sanji's development till then is that he got the most coverage for a strawhat other than Luffy and yet didnt get a decent match. Once the cake was baked, we saw him move at high speed against Oven but all that left us with a disappointment for further fights. We cannot complain about Sanji not getting coverage, only about Sanji not being represented in a strong manner. This oculd do with Jinbei being in the mix, but nevertheless wasn't enough.

But i dont agree, or atleast dont feel the most recent events have shown him unfairly. At any given stage, Sanji will not him woman. We know that, we can expect that and we know he will come out worse than that. Oda did a great job representing it hte previous chapter too, only the strawhats understood his problem whereas the rest of them voiced their opinions like the fans of the show. But to expect Sanji to hit a woman is ridiculous. I am looking to see what else could he have done?

THe only thing i can think of is using Diable Jamble to escape the spider nets. Brooks mentioned it in Thriller bark that burning them would release and thats what Franky did. Maybe if Sanji had escaped in that fashion, it would've been a better representation but it would've done injustice to Black Maria as a character. Black Maria needed a build up to fight Robin, the 5th strongest easily in the strawhat crew. Sanji needing to be saved was a nice way and if we ignore how he's been shown post Dressrosa till now, i wouldn't complain about that. All issues with Sanji are limited to that point for me, not since.

I think just run like hell, he didn't need to fight women at all.

 

[Fox666]

THe only thing i can think of is using Diable Jamble to escape the spider nets. Brooks mentioned it in Thriller bark that burning them would release and thats what Franky did. Maybe if Sanji had escaped in that fashion, it would've been a better representation but it would've done injustice to Black Maria as a character. Black Maria needed a build up to fight Robin, the 5th strongest easily in the strawhat crew. Sanji needing to be saved was a nice way and if we ignore how he's been shown post Dressrosa till now, i wouldn't complain about that. All issues with Sanji are limited to that point for me, not since.

Sanji can activate Diable Jamble by moving his body at incredibly high speed. Even if he appears to be able to activate it at will post-timeskip, on theory he still have to move in order to activate it.

 

[hokageji]

I think just run like hell, he didn't need to fight women at all.

Well, that is fair but once you are caught in a spider trap, there is no escape unless from an external source. So i guess Sanji did try and failed and the manga is showing it in that fashion. He was further handicapped by the attackers being all woman making him hard to fight back...

Sanji can activate Diable Jamble by moving his body at incredibly high speed. Even if he appears to be able to activate it at will post-timeskip, on theory he still have to move in order to activate it.

There you go, so by all means once caught, Sanji had no escape other than hitting woman which is a no go right? I maintain the stand that he wasn't represented poorly post entering Black Maria's den, its inline with the character. Before that, perhaps....

 

[Fox666]

There you go, so by all means once caught, Sanji had no escape other than hitting woman which is a no go right? I maintain the stand that he wasn't represented poorly post entering Black Maria's den, its inline with the character. Before that, perhaps....

Once caught in the spider web, Sanji had no way to escape.

All he could do is hardening his body to block attacks. Even so, Black Maria could torture him by other means, such as waterboarding.

 

[Monox D. I-Fly]

But i dont agree, or atleast dont feel the most recent events have shown him unfairly. At any given stage, Sanji will not him woman. We know that, we can expect that and we know he will come out worse than that. Oda did a great job representing it hte previous chapter too, only the strawhats understood his problem whereas the rest of them voiced their opinions like the fans of the show. But to expect Sanji to hit a woman is ridiculous. I am looking to see what else could he have done?

Sanji sparred an attack from Big Mom (kicking her fist) and several from Califa (kicking her kicks). He also kicked Nami out of Bege's body to save her.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Once caught in the spider web, Sanji had no way to escape.

Actually, no.

Sanji was not caught in the web. He was only strung up and had his upper body bound initially.

We know he uses legs to fight... his legs aren't bound.

In Chapter 998, Sanji was actually found running and escaping, then he decided to stay because.

It's after this that he defeated all the men (which we're not shown), and then he gets captured.

How did he defeat this men? Obviously with his legs, that's his combat style.

Fact he stayed when he could escape, and defeated all the males proves he could have escaped.

He has a Raid Suit to turn invisible which even Page One couldn't detect... he's the fastest characters according to some (don't think he is faster than Luffy or Zoro)... he can fly and use Geppou.

There's no excuse for why he couldn't escape.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 9, 2021, Original Post Date: Mar 9, 2021 ---

All he could do is hardening his body to block attacks. Even so, Black Maria could torture him by other means, such as waterboarding.

Not at all. He could have escaped, he just chose not to.

There's no way he defeats all the males, and had to definitely get caught.

If there was no way to escape, all the males wouldn't be defeated. He'd have been caught.

He could absolutely have done more than just harden his body.

 

[kkck]

I am not necessarily convinced that sanji really couldn't have escaped the room with BM and her crew... But whether he could have or not, it happened off screen so it only makes sense to think sanji was as pathetic off screen, or more, as he is on screen. To bad the room he was in didn't have a kitchen, otherwise he might have baked a cake and won the day while his comrades got slaughtered.

 

[XXGenesis]

That’s why unlike the Kalifa battles. This representation of Sanji in such a manner is just stupid.

It’s the non-resistant we are seen Sanji showing to, hostile enemies that are woman. If you won’t & can’t fight, you should just run away. Sure go for the tag, but it’s too much when you combine it with screaming out Robin’s name..Lawwwd have mercy on us readers, Sanji is written to be very annoying these days.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

I didn't even find this intentionally... and we find the moron actually looking for Women instead of going to save Momonosuke when they just broke into Onigashima.

He did save Momo, but he first prioritised women.

At this point, he wasn't in danger, he wasn't being held captive... and the only thing he can think of in a war... is women? After he'd been peeping.

I can't even not speculate that the entire way up the stairs of the castle with Luffy and Jimbei... Sanji was actually looking to sense women the entire time and of course... he did find the,.

There just isn't anything positive to say about this guy. He's really the worst.

 

[Zoroark90]

Sanji is written to be very annoying these days.

I agree and I do hope they do some justice to his character ...

 

[Prince13333]

I didn't even find this intentionally... and we find the moron actually looking for Women instead of going to save Momonosuke when they just broke into Onigashima.

He did save Momo, but he first prioritised women.

At this point, he wasn't in danger, he wasn't being held captive... and the only thing he can think of in a war... is women? After he'd been peeping.

I can't even not speculate that the entire way up the stairs of the castle with Luffy and Jimbei... Sanji was actually looking to sense women the entire time and of course... he did find the,.

There just isn't anything positive to say about this guy. He's really the worst.

"isn't anything positive"....... Really? Sanji hasn't had any positive moments at all to you in this arc? Its just been all bad?

 

[M3J]

What has he done this arc though?