Discussion Spriggan 12 General Thread

[WoWfan]

Since this thread is up I'd like to know: why do Brandish's stans think she can Organ Burst so easily when she hasn't even shown this ability ? How can Brandish VS FT or Brandish VS Diabolos threads exist when she can't even solo Lucy ?

since she can affect something like a tumor, there is no reason she couldn't target any other organ. Brandish was stated to be going easy and even intended to lose to Lucy.

 

[Garmadooon]

since she can affect something like a tumor, there is no reason she couldn't target any other organ. Brandish was stated to be going easy and even intended to lose to Lucy.

Ok she intends to lose against Lucy so she is unable to play with the FT guild Thanks for the confirmation.

 

[WoWfan]

Ok she intends to lose against Lucy so she is unable to play with the FT guild Thanks for the confirmation.

intending to lose to someone is not really the same as not playing with FT, considering that she can affect someone as strong as Natsu. but not all of them at once sure

 

[Shiki_Dragneel]

The only Alvarez characters that got nerfed and held back due to the plot IMO are Acnologia Zeref August Irene Bloodman God Serena. The other Spriggans have no excuse for their shitty performance and Glass Cannon level defense/durability.

But it's a fact that the S12 were only defeated because of plot. Without that they could easily defeat Ishgar.

Without Ultear plot appearance during that battle Dimaria would have killed Wendy and Cherria.

Without Hiros dumb writing Gajeel would be dead or at least Bloodman should survive too. But sadly he isn't a FT member.

Without the bs plot Gray and Juvia would both died against Invel but again Invel like Dimaria had bad luck that Gray's rage was stronger than Invel....makes no sense but okay.

Without Stings white ds magic, they would also died in the battle against Larcade. Most of them even Gildarts would have probably died throught his pleasure magic. Larcade is a etherion why didn't he use his etherious form? Well again a plot device for the ishgar mages?

Without Brandishs soft side she could probably killed most of them. Like I said she could easily turn her S12 comrades to big giants like she did with Gajeel too. Image a fucking big Dimaria or Bloodman.....plot strikes again.

Without Jacobs fucking virgin personality he would killed Lucy, Natsu and Mira in his battle against them. That wasn't funny what Hiro made, it was sad.

Without Hiros dicision to let God Serena be killed by the hand of Acnologia he would be a very strong opponent against Gildarts, even if Gildarts would win, he would lose a lot of magic power and couldn't fight against August. So God Serena had to be killed.

Without Irenes mother feelings Erza and Wendy would die in few secs.....the plot strikes again.

Without August fear against holder magic he would killed Gildarts and Cana. WTF I don't know what Hiro thought when he wrote that.

Without the plot Laxus probably wouldn't win against Wall, then Wall could use his attack that he used at the beginning of the war, with that he shot a 400 km long laser or why didn't he use Etherion? Plot again...

Only S12 who lost without plot or would lose anyways were Neinhart and Ajeel. But only his battle against Erza, Ajeels battle against Elfman and Lisanna was plot bs too.

Same thing with Neinhart, what was the reason behind "show you're true self" or what ever Irene said to Neinhart....makes no sense, because we never saw it. Maybe because Hiro thought he would be to strong? I don't know.

 

[WoWfan]

But it's a fact that the S12 were only defeated because of plot. Without that they could easily defeat Ishgar.

Without Ultear plot appearance during that battle Dimaria would have killed Wendy and Cherria.

Without Hiros dumb writing Gajeel would be dead or at least Bloodman should survive too. But sadly he isn't a FT member.

Without the bs plot Gray and Juvia would both died against Invel but again Invel like Dimaria had bad luck that Gray's rage was stronger than Invel....makes no sense but okay.

Without Stings white ds magic, they would also died in the battle against Larcade. Most of them even Gildarts would have probably died throught his pleasure magic. Larcade is a etherion why didn't he use his etherious form? Well again a plot device for the ishgar mages?

Without Brandishs soft side she could probably killed most of them. Like I said she could easily turn her S12 comrades to big giants like she did with Gajeel too. Image a fucking big Dimaria or Bloodman.....plot strikes again.

Without Jacobs fucking virgin personality he would killed Lucy, Natsu and Mira in his battle against them. That wasn't funny what Hiro made, it was sad.

Without Hiros dicision to let God Serena be killed by the hand of Acnologia he would be a very strong opponent against Gildarts, even if Gildarts would win, he would lose a lot of magic power and couldn't fight against August. So God Serena had to be killed.

Without Irenes mother feelings Erza and Wendy would die in few secs.....the plot strikes again.

Without August fear against holder magic he would killed Gildarts and Cana. WTF I don't know what Hiro thought when he wrote that.

Without the plot Laxus probably wouldn't win against Wall, then Wall could use his attack that he used at the beginning of the war, with that he shot a 400 km long laser or why didn't he use Etherion? Plot again...

Only S12 who lost without plot or would lose anyways were Neinhart and Ajeel. But only his battle against Erza, Ajeels battle against Elfman and Lisanna was plot bs too.

Same thing with Neinhart, what was the reason behind "show you're true self" or what ever Irene said to Neinhart....makes no sense, because we never saw it. Maybe because Hiro thought he would be to strong? I don't know.

Actually Jacob was holding back too as he was trying to get info out of FT members about FH, and with Elfman played on Ajeel’s strength and Lisanna compensated for his weakness too.

 

[Darklord#10]

Ajeel got fucked real hard. From being an Erza level opponent to being absolute fodder to elfman and lissana that's deadass bullshit. And don't even give me that bs that he got countered. The guy legit gave Erza a run for her money and he gets clapped by fucking elfman and lissana? Fodders? He was probably the only spriggan who got a good mix of stats MP and hax. People may not know but after Eileen ajeel got fucked real hard he probably rivals Eileen in that aspect

 

[Garmadooon]

Ajeel got fucked real hard. From being an Erza level opponent to being absolute fodder to elfman and lissana that's deadass bullshit. And don't even give me that bs that he got countered. The guy legit gave Erza a run for her money and he gets clapped by fucking elfman and lissana? Fodders? He was probably the only spriggan who got a good mix of stats MP and hax. People may not know but after Eileen ajeel got fucked real hard he probably rivals Eileen in that aspect

Erza didn't have her horrible POF + Mary Sue Power against Ajeel. And she was defeated by Marin's hax. All of this explains why she should have been fed instantly by an enchantment from Irene. But Irene had the merit of winning against her by being pissed off by the plot.

 

[MyaHeart35]

Erza didn't have her horrible POF + Mary Sue Power against Ajeel. And she was defeated by Marin's hax. All of this explains why she should have been fed instantly by an enchantment from Irene. But Irene had the merit of winning against her by being pissed off by the plot.

Even without the POF, Elfman and Lisanna shouldn't have been able to take down Ajeel. It doesn't make sense in the slightest. I'm pretty sure Mashima doesn't even know how they won.

 

[WoWfan]

Even without the POF, Elfman and Lisanna shouldn't have been able to take down Ajeel. It doesn't make sense in the slightest. I'm pretty sure Mashima doesn't even know how they won.

Sure it was anti-climatic and rushed and off screen for most of the time. At least they worked to play on his weakness and compensated for their own.

 

[Shoutmon]

I feel like all the Spriggan got done dirty in their own special way, but imo by far the worst was Nienhart.

Dude was shaping up to be my favourite of the group up until his introduction. He straight up ignored Zeref's orders while sitting in his palace, had this ominous silhouette while waiting in the ship, didn't like working with the other spriggan according to Dimaria, and was in general kept in the dark while the other 2 had their fights.

It actually feels like Mashima retconned him on the spot when he was introduced. His design, personality and powerset were all garbage, and he was only disobedient towards Zeref, because he was too busy being completely subservient to Irene, another spriggan!

After being oneshotted, he gets downgraded from a simp to a drone by Irene (who berates him as she's enchanting him) and he then gets oneshotted again, completely cementing his status as the laughingstock of the Spriggan.

I'll never understand what the point was with doing this to the guy, 'cause I'm 99% sure the story would've been way better off with just having him live up to his hype

 

[Darklord#10]

Even without the POF, Elfman and Lisanna shouldn't have been able to take down Ajeel. It doesn't make sense in the slightest. I'm pretty sure Mashima doesn't even know how they won.

Lol mashima doesn't even know how laxus and Mira were able to touch skullion. How's he going to know about that . That's why the fight happened off screen.

 

[grey matter]

Lol mashima doesn't even know how laxus and Mira were able to touch skullion. How's he going to know about that . That's why the fight happened off screen.

100%
Off screen is Mashima's way to do something that is completely non sensical..

Madmole no sold FDK demo fist from Natsu. Natsu had to outright resort to heat rather than attack power to damage him. Skullion stomped Gray.
They went from this, to stalemating Mira and Elfman, who are collectively << Natsu and Gray. And how Mashima did it? OFF SCREEN.
They then went from this, to getting no diff'd by base Laxus. IDK what anyone says, base Laxus isn't no diffing Mira and Elfman collectively lol. And how Mashima do it? OFF SCREEN

Mashima also off screened Jacob vs Mira, Elfman + Lissana vs Ajeel.
Cause there is no way Jacob and Ajeel aren't stomping in their matchups if we are being real. So Mashima HAD to off screen these fights.

 

[WoWfan]

100%
Off screen is Mashima's way to do something that is completely non sensical..

Madmole no sold FDK demo fist from Natsu. Natsu had to outright resort to heat rather than attack power to damage him. Skullion stomped Gray.
They went from this, to stalemating Mira and Elfman, who are collectively << Natsu and Gray. And how Mashima did it? OFF SCREEN.
They then went from this, to getting no diff'd by base Laxus. IDK what anyone says, base Laxus isn't no diffing Mira and Elfman collectively lol. And how Mashima do it? OFF SCREEN

Mashima also off screened Jacob vs Mira, Elfman + Lissana vs Ajeel.
Cause there is no way Jacob and Ajeel aren't stomping in their matchups if we are being real. So Mashima HAD to off screen these fights.

Actually Mashima gave a on screen for Mira vs Jacob in the animated version and stated that Jacob was weakened in the manga.

 

[Ratrace]

I feel like all the Spriggan got done dirty in their own special way, but imo by far the worst was Nienhart.

Dude was shaping up to be my favourite of the group up until his introduction. He straight up ignored Zeref's orders while sitting in his palace, had this ominous silhouette while waiting in the ship, didn't like working with the other spriggan according to Dimaria, and was in general kept in the dark while the other 2 had their fights.

It actually feels like Mashima retconned him on the spot when he was introduced. His design, personality and powerset were all garbage, and he was only disobedient towards Zeref, because he was too busy being completely subservient to Irene, another spriggan!

After being oneshotted, he gets downgraded from a simp to a drone by Irene (who berates him as she's enchanting him) and he then gets oneshotted again, completely cementing his status as the laughingstock of the Spriggan.

I'll never understand what the point was with doing this to the guy, 'cause I'm 99% sure the story would've been way better off with just having him live up to his hype

his silhouette made it seem like Mashima had a different idea for his design but changed his mind later on because this looks somewhat different than what we got

FAIRY TAIL - Vol. 53 Ch. 452 - Prelude To the Final Battle - MangaDex

Read FAIRY TAIL Vol. 53 Ch. 452 "Prelude To the Final Battle" on MangaDex!

mangadex.org

 

[Jhonatas Fernandes]

I'm not buying the "Brandish held back on Lucy because Dimaria was watching her". Thing is, Lucy could overwhelm her with her basic attacks even when she was tiny. I could even argue why Current Lucy can beat Brandish.

Let me explain: in the fight Lucy/Cana VS Brandish she had no reason to hold back. She was mad at Lucy and wanted to kill her before Aquarius came back (a very bullshit moment by the way). Why didn't she burst her organs or Cana's? DiMaria wasn't there to watch her; she had no reason to be afraid.

And for those who say "Brandish One Shotted Natsu"

1- Natsu was caught off guard he didn't fight her
2- Natsu was weakened because of all the battles he chained
3- She took advantage of his tumor and his cancer to deceive him

Why are not buying something that is explicitly said by Dimaria? Brandish wanted to fake a fight with Lucy because Dimaria was watching them and she wanted to fake that she lost to Lucy. Dimaria has said it clearly.

About "Lucy/Cana Vs Brandish": Brandish just wanted to gain time to put her clothes to deal with Lucy properly, so she made Lucy run away by shrinking the house. The thing is: when a person is so strong compared to another, this person wouldn't bother to kill his opponent quickly. In Brandish's case, she wanted to explain her reasons to Lucy first. According to Mashima's bizarre writing, Brandish doesn't really have anything personal against Lucy, she just wanted to kill someone dear to Layla in order to get some personal revenge.

Brandish easily shrunk a cut in Mirajane's heart without August perceiving, thus she officially can make organs get bigger or smaller. Her personality is what makes her don't do this kind of thing.

 

[Ronin31]

But it's a fact that the S12 were only defeated because of plot. Without that they could easily defeat Ishgar.

Without Ultear plot appearance during that battle Dimaria would have killed Wendy and Cherria.

Without Hiros dumb writing Gajeel would be dead or at least Bloodman should survive too. But sadly he isn't a FT member.

Without the bs plot Gray and Juvia would both died against Invel but again Invel like Dimaria had bad luck that Gray's rage was stronger than Invel....makes no sense but okay.

Without Stings white ds magic, they would also died in the battle against Larcade. Most of them even Gildarts would have probably died throught his pleasure magic. Larcade is a etherion why didn't he use his etherious form? Well again a plot device for the ishgar mages?

Without Brandishs soft side she could probably killed most of them. Like I said she could easily turn her S12 comrades to big giants like she did with Gajeel too. Image a fucking big Dimaria or Bloodman.....plot strikes again.

Without Jacobs fucking virgin personality he would killed Lucy, Natsu and Mira in his battle against them. That wasn't funny what Hiro made, it was sad.

Without Hiros dicision to let God Serena be killed by the hand of Acnologia he would be a very strong opponent against Gildarts, even if Gildarts would win, he would lose a lot of magic power and couldn't fight against August. So God Serena had to be killed.

Without Irenes mother feelings Erza and Wendy would die in few secs.....the plot strikes again.

Without August fear against holder magic he would killed Gildarts and Cana. WTF I don't know what Hiro thought when he wrote that.

Without the plot Laxus probably wouldn't win against Wall, then Wall could use his attack that he used at the beginning of the war, with that he shot a 400 km long laser or why didn't he use Etherion? Plot again...

Only S12 who lost without plot or would lose anyways were Neinhart and Ajeel. But only his battle against Erza, Ajeels battle against Elfman and Lisanna was plot bs too.

Same thing with Neinhart, what was the reason behind "show you're true self" or what ever Irene said to Neinhart....makes no sense, because we never saw it. Maybe because Hiro thought he would be to strong? I don't know.

All you said is right and this is why even currently, all Spriggans are shown to be incredible wizards. Hype and Charism.
God Serena, Brandish, Eileen.... They are all hype as almost the strongest wizards.

 

[Jhonatas Fernandes]

Even without the POF, Elfman and Lisanna shouldn't have been able to take down Ajeel. It doesn't make sense in the slightest. I'm pretty sure Mashima doesn't even know how they won.

Maybe they could use Unison Raid, thus, they have created a final very strong attack. Besides that, Ajeel didn't use Sand World in the fight (since it would impact all other fights too), so he didn't use all his tricks. And Elfman probably could disperse Ajeel's magic with the Sand Best... So perhaps, because of all of these factors, Elfman and Lisanna's victory makes sense.​

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 26, 2023, Original Post Date: Aug 26, 2023 ---

I think Neinhart is the case of a mage who is very powerful if he takes measures against his weakness: the fact that he isn't good in endurance, but the narrative conveniently chooses to portray him as someone who ignores it and doesn't bother to hide or protect himself properly (in the port, it seems that he was so confident about his victory that he didn't look for his weakness; and when he attacked Brandish, he was in a berserker mode because Irene's enchantment, so I don't blame him for it, once Irene forced him to go directly in the battlefield looking for Erza). His feats are pretty good: he damaged Erza to the point that she was knocked out and he held all the mages in the port for a while, and the were relevant mages there, such as Laxus, Gray, and Wendy. He also held Minerva and Rogue for a long time, and even Gildarts needed to put some medium effort to defeat one of Neinharts "summons", Historia God Serena.​

 

[Cosmicstar]

The issue with Lissana and Elfman vs ajeel is that they don’t posses the attack power to take out an opponent like Ajeel. I can see them holding out but I can’t see them damaging Ajeel the way they did logically. This is why the fight was off panel because Hiro couldn’t create a logical win for Elfman and Lissana.

 

[Jhonatas Fernandes]

The issue with Lissana and Elfman vs ajeel is that they don’t posses the attack power to take out an opponent like Ajeel. I can see them holding out but I can’t see them damaging Ajeel the way they did logically. This is why the fight was off panel because Hiro couldn’t create a logical win for Elfman and Lissana.

I agree, the only way to them defeat Ajeel would be with a Unison Raid attack, just as strong as when Gray and Juvia created a strong spell to defeat Lyon and Sherria, and the Aldoron warrior, etc.

 

[MyaHeart35]

The issue with Lissana and Elfman vs ajeel is that they don’t posses the attack power to take out an opponent like Ajeel. I can see them holding out but I can’t see them damaging Ajeel the way they did logically. This is why the fight was off panel because Hiro couldn’t create a logical win for Elfman and Lissana.

Yeah especially since it took an attack from Erza in nakagami and a hit from a Jupiter cannon. Tbh it seemed Ajeel had one of the best durability amongst the spriggans.