Discussion What is a True Pirate King?

[Hannibal Psyche]

Introduction​

Source: Chapter 2​

One Piece is an object that no one besides the Gorosei know about in detail; it's well known that the general public and majority of Pirates do not have a clue as to what One Piece is⁽⁵⁰⁷⁾.

Doesn't it strike odd that One Piece is being sought for by all Pirates in the world? Yet, the majority have no clue what it is? for all they know, it could be a treasure chest full of biscuits.

The one thing that they know concerning One Piece is that it was owned by Roger.

Contention​

If Oda told us that he was holding a competition, and whoever was able to reach a designated location in this competition and find a golden egg, they would get a special canon-chapter that hasn't been ever released, as a gift; can you imagine what would happen?

We'd all end up brawling, Kicking and fighting everyone regarded as competition to guarantee we got the golden egg.

What has this challenge caused? It has caused contention. Why has it caused contention? because we all desire to get this golden egg.

What would this prove at the end? whomever was able to successfully carry-out this goal in-spite of the competition is the strongest out of all those competing.

Can this analogy & rationale be applied to One Piece? just like Oda's challenge to the fans, it gathers people from all over the world because it's desirable. Therefore, One Piece is a source of contention whose process ultimately reveals the strongest.

Bare in mind. the ability to defeat all opposition or being the strongest is merely 1 facet and requirement in the goal to becoming Pirate King.

What is the Grand Line​

The Grand Line can be split into 2 halves; the first half is known as Paradise⁽⁶⁹⁾, while the other is known as the New World⁽⁴³³⁾.

The first half of the Grand Line is like a survival test which tests Pirate crew's ability to somewhat, survive in the New World⁽⁴⁹⁸⁾.

The result of successfully traversing Paradise is reaching the Red-Line or Sabaody which is a difficult challenge⁽⁴⁹⁸⁾.

Progressing from the Red-Line, one reaches the New World; what makes it so special is the fact that, unlike Paradise, the strength of opposition is gargantuan⁽⁴³³⁾.

Being aware of this fact, Gecko Moriah ridicules the SHs ability to survive in the New World because he deems their strength insufficient at this point and rightly so⁽⁴⁸¹⁾.

Strength​

One of the requirements heavily put emphasis on is the need to possess the strength required to defeat all challengers because the goal to be Pirate King can only foot 1 person, and that's the strongest⁽⁷¹⁷⁾.

Chinjao goes on to point out that a Pirate King doesn't only defeat the Yonko (the 4 main Pirates ruling portions of the New World), but the Admirals too if necessary⁽⁷¹⁹⁾.

Blackbeard claims that this is his age (Pirate Kings own ages) after he's determined himself to be the Strongest Pirate as a result of consuming the Yami Yami no Mi and the Gura Gura no Mi⁽⁵⁷⁷⁾, who can blame him? Strength is the means by which one becomes Pirate King.

Spoiler: Pirate Age = Claims to be Pirate King

Bare in mind that claiming ownership to an age is tantamount to claiming to be Pirate King.

Ace also makes use of the term "this age" will belong to Whitebeard⁽⁵⁷³⁾, because he planned to make Whitebeard Pirate King⁽⁴⁴¹⁾; Blackbeard himself claims he'll be Pirate King⁽⁴⁴⁰⁾ because he had plans to make himself strongest as he told Ace, albeit, in no details.

This establishes and shows how the Pirate King title is associated with unyielding strength.

Luffy himself summarizes that by defeating both Yonko and Admirals, he'll be Pirate King⁽⁷⁹⁸⁾; while lamenting over Ace's death, he acidly describes what a Pirate King can't be, and that's weak⁽⁵⁸⁹⁾.

Aptly put, Strength is the vehicle that enables one to stay on-course in the journey to be Pirate King; it however is not the only determinant.

How to be Pirate King​

Source: Chapter 831​

As important as strength is, we can see that Whitebeard was referred to as the World Strongest Pirate after Roger's death⁽²³³ - ⁵²⁴⁾; it still didn't mean he was Pirate King, what is he missing?

One Piece (click to learn in detail) is wealth Roger added unto a 900 year old artefact to lead a certain person into finding out the secret of the world (Rio-Ponelglyph) which has been in existence for 900+ years; Roger's wealth leads people to this 900+ years old artefact that the WG do not want found under any circumstances.

Source: 817 & 820​

Though, Pirates in Roger's era weren't looking for One Piece (the wealth he kept at at Raftel where the final Poneglyphs is located), they were nonetheless looking for the Raftel & Poneglyphs (the the world's secret) which precedes Roger, it is 900+ years old.

Various Pirates during Roger's era had been to the Island at the end of the log-pose, so they would inevitably learn of the Raftel & the Poneglyphs existence; ultimately, the Pirates who made it this far would end up all being in contention for it; this also implies that only Pirates who were deep (successful) in the New World would be aware of this.

Note: Not many people became Pirates until Roger started the age of Pirates.

The greatest Pirates of the era were aware of this⁽⁴³⁴⁾; Roger as we know was privy to Raftel & the Poneglyphs; Whitebeard went to Wano and met with Oden; Shiki (sbs) knew about the existence of the Ancient Weapons; this implies they all arrived at the Island at the end of the log-pose which explains why they're all in contention.

Spoiler: Roger's Strength

Roger fought Whitebeard on numerous occasions⁽⁴³⁴⁾; contended with Shiki⁽⁵⁶⁵·⁵⁾; destroyed an entire country's army for simply insulting his crew⁽⁵⁸⁸⁾; annihilated many crews⁽⁵⁶³⁾ (Squardo's crew being one of them); it's quite apparent he was contentious.

We're even told that Roger was a wall to Shiki and Whitebeard which meant Roger stopped them from achieving their goals⁽⁵⁶⁵·⁵⁾. This informs us that he was superior to his opponents.

Crocodile elaborates on that briefly by referring to Roger as a wall, he means impossible to defeat ⁽⁵²⁹⁾; this partially explains why Roger was able to Pirate king⁽⁵⁶⁵·⁵⁾.

The implications of finding One Piece are catastrophic in the wrong hands due to the fact it includes the Ancient Weapons which make one's military power and political influence subsequently unrivalled as Crocodile surmised⁽¹⁹³⁾.

In conclusion, Pirate King is whomever can both Conquer the Grand Line and obtain One Piece, they'd not only be the most physically powerful, but also politically due to the Ancient Weapons & acquired knowledge. Whitebeard never did, he got half-way there; he had the strength, but never went to Raftel to acquire power; like Joker said, he ruled before the throne⁽⁸⁰¹⁾.

 

[ProGoddess]

Very interesting theory. You must have put a lot of thoughts in it.

The difference of Luffy from others is that he openly declares that he will be the future pirate king. He makes it clear that he strongly believes in One Piece and is going for it. He is so frank that sometimes the listeners may wonder if he really means it. These can be seen through many occasions, for example when he answers snail-phone calls. In fact he does not even hide his full name when making introduction of himself.

I believe power lies with the tongue. For Luffy, it is like a self-proclaiming prophecy. His character also plays a part to it - one who is positive and outgoing, and is always looking forward. During his childhood when he was always "tortured" by his grandpa, he has already portrayed such traits. His "not giving up" spirit has further motivated him to strive toward his goal.

I guess these may be the least in order to succeed one's goal - to be a pirate king.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Very interesting theory. You must have put a lot of thoughts in it.

The difference of Luffy from others is that he openly declares that he will be the future pirate king. He makes it clear that he strongly believes in One Piece and is going for it. He is so frank that sometimes the listeners may wonder if he really means it. These can be seen through many occasions, for example when he answers snail-phone calls. In fact he does not even hide his full name when making introduction of himself.

I believe power lies with the tongue. For Luffy, it is like a self-proclaiming prophecy. His character also plays a part to it - one who is positive and outgoing, and is always looking forward. During his childhood when he was always "tortured" by his grandpa, he has already portrayed such traits. His "not giving up" spirit has further motivated him to strive toward his goal.

I guess these may be the least in order to succeed one's goal - to be a pirate king.

It took a while, a lot of effort indeed, . I think a lot of things in One Piece can be understood, but Oda spreads them across, so I find re-reading old chapters again and again because I'm sure there are things I've missed; it' part of the fun in One Piece, I'm sure Starwars fans are similarly obsessed, haha.

I do like the point you made about Luffy prophesying it, he's one of the few to boldly prophecy his ambitions out loud, and Coby too which is unusual in light of characters that have appeared to be much more confident looking than himself, e.g. Kid. We're yet to hear the likes of Kid, Apoo, Law and many others say exactly they want to be Pirate King, it seems even they themselves consider it almost ludicrous a claim to make even though, they most likely do aim to make attempts at it.

 

[ProGoddess]

One way or another, people do want/wish to climb higher to fulfill their dream. Being a pirate, who doesn't want to be the most powerful and influential figure in piracy? The question is who can achieve it? What are their motives or reasons?

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

One way or another, people do want/wish to climb higher to fulfill their dream. Being a pirate, who doesn't want to be the most powerful and influential figure in piracy? The question is who can achieve it? What are their motives or reasons?

At the moment, I think any reason is sufficient as long as they can fulfil 2 criteria:

• Possess the strength.
• Prove that they're the strongest by defeating core powerful Pirates (Yonko particularly).

I initially believed Pirate King was accomplished by Raftel, but it opened up questions like:

• If we assume Raftel for example was why Roger was considered Pirate King, then why isn't Rayleigh Pirate King by default now that Roger is dead? Whitebeard has no clue where One Piece is, nor where Raftel is, yet considered closest to the throne despite Rayleigh's existence.

Another is One Piece is required to be Pirate King, at least is the most commonly believed way one becomes Pirate King; someone finds One Piece, and automatically becomes Pirate King. I do believe One Piece guides towards Pirate King due to the fact that it'd be fought over for, but not explicitly for finding it as I don't believe it has some sort of magical power.

Premise here is If I said I want to sprint against Usain Bolt in a 100M race, I wouldn't be surprised to get a response like "He's the fastest runner in the would, you can't beat him".

If I take Sengoku's comment, he tells Shiki "Roger is Pirate King, you can't defeat him". If Pirate King means Proven strongest, then the sentence to me is interpreted as Roger has proven to be the strongest, you can't defeat him as an absolute fact.

Or, if Pirate King means to have found One Piece, then it's like Sengoku is saying Roger found the greatest treasure, you can't defeat. It's questionable why treasure should make someone victor in a battle, so it makes less sense for me.

Or, Pirate King referring to having reached Raftel. It's like Sengoku is saying Roger has reached Raftel, you can't defeat him. Reaching an Island shouldn't have any influence on the outcome of battle, so it makes less sense.

Based on everything, I think proving to be strongest by defeating the core strongest individuals is what will ultimately determine one to be Pirate King, and more so since Pirate King is also referred to as Conquering the Grand Line which alludes to contention by force.

If we also consider that he was also called Pirate King by the people of the world, the outcome of battles spread like wild fire, but the whereabouts and routes are not something that people will know about, I'm sure people didn't know Roger went to Sky Island or visited the City of Gold.

I tend to base a lot of my analysis via linguistics, might be over the top, .

 

[ProGoddess]

It seems like being a pirate king is to go through the adventures Oda sets. I reckon what we are seeing is what a pirate king is - through Luffy. Look at how he started as merely a little (insignificant) town's boy to what he is now. I believe a pirate king must be able to go through the multitudes of trials and errors, and even life and death in order to succeed as a pirate king.

Wanna be a pirate king? It probably includes all those (criteria) you have mentioned.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

It seems like being a pirate king is to go through the adventures Oda sets. I reckon what we are seeing is what a pirate king is - through Luffy. Look at how he started as merely a little (insignificant) town's boy to what he is now. I believe a pirate king must be able to go through the multitudes of trials and errors, and even life and death in order to succeed as a pirate king.

Wanna be a pirate king? It probably includes all those (criteria) you have mentioned.

He's come a long way, and as you say about trials, it's very much so and he's proven how much of an overcomer he is. Shanks said something very similar to your comment if I recall.

Spoiler

Shows I can still make improvements on this work to make it more articulate and easier to understand.

 

[ProGoddess]

You have written well, Han! I have enjoyed reading your posts. You may include more ideas which inspire you along the way.

As for Shanks, he must have foreseen something about Luffy since then to make such comment.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

You have written well, Han! I have enjoyed reading your posts. You may include more ideas which inspire you along the way.

As for Shanks, he must have foreseen something about Luffy since then to make such comment.

Thanks, appreciated.

 

[M3J]

To be a pirate king is to be fully confident in your abilities, which Luffy is. Furthermore, not only must you be confident but you must be able to back up your boasts or desire as to why you should be a pirate king, as Luffy and Roger have done.

As for what it really means, I guess that's up to definition. Luffy's definition is to be free to roam the seas, which is pretty important. Others' definition is to find the One Piece, which I find to be to restrictive because it doesn't necessarily make one the king. Luffy's definition fits best because it means he's powerful enough to go anywhere he likes, especially after finding the One Piece.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

There's this belief that Roger and Garp were equals, of course, that's a Mangapanda/Mangareader Translation.

In the Viz:

Roger: We've been fighting each other for years, I trust you as much as any of my shipmates!

Garp was never equals with Roger, he was just one of the few people strong enough to fight with him.

Also, we see that Roger is saying "I have to bring down Roger myself!" which has few interpretations such as...

For example, "I have to get an A*", implies an A* grade has not yet been achieved. In Garp's case, it might even mean that he was only able to fight against Roger with aid since he's also stating he wants to bring down Roger himself.

It does seem to show he wasn't ever able to bring down Roger, which means, Roger was superior to Garp and more so, being that he became Pirate King 2 years after the Ed war battle against Shiki.

 

[ProGoddess]

Equal in terms of status or abilities/capabilities? Help me understand your view.

Garp and Roger appeared to be two powerful people who had been crushing over numerous times, or rather, as what it was said, Garp had cornered Roger many times.

Perhaps that was why Garp wanted to capture Roger personally. If he had been trying so many times and failed, his pride would definitely get hurt. When Roger was in the jail cell, in that same chapter you had posted, Roger said that they had "faced each other dozens of times in battle" indicating that they fought but Garp couldn't captured him. At the same time, Garp wasn't killed by Roger either. I suspect that both parties might have gotten injured in their numerous battles, but none could bring down each other. Additionally, the two of them seemed to have such unshakeable determination (mentality) with one having "I refused to be captured" and the other with "I must capture him". It seems like "pride" is at work.

At the end of the day, Roger turned himself in due to his personal reason - terminal illness, and he asked Garp a special and exceptional favour.

In the issue of "comrade-ship" - one is a Marine Official and the other is a Pirate. They are not "equal" (or I should say different) in their social status (and norms), at least in terms of their occupation and the position they each were holding. However I do not sense their hostility towards each other. Garp seems to be a person who has a "passionate" heart. When I say this, I mean that he is not a Marine soldier who would kill just because the other person is a criminal/pirate.

Both seemed to respect each other. Perhaps due to their numerous clashes, they might feel the closeness to each other. For Roger to ask that "favour", he must have trusted Garp fully as he knew his wives and children would be killed. If he had made the wrong decision and misjudged Garp, Ace would not be born. One of the cruelest things to do is to kill a baby while he/she is still in the mother womb. Both mother and child die.

For this reason, that was why Roger thought of Garp like his crewmate, one whom he could trust and entrust his final bloodline to.

I do not think it is so much of outward standing, but more to the emotional impact that influences their relationship.

 

[M3J]

Roger trusted Garp because Garp isn't an asshole like Akainu, he seems to be a noble person who wants to do good, like when he let Luffy punch him or admitted he was conflicted and considered Ace his family. I assume it's Garp's character that got Roger to trust him, could be due to Garp saving someone despite the risk to his life or not going after Roger when Roger did something good, much like Smoker and Tashigi at Alabasta.

Anyway, being a pirate king seems to be simple: it's either getting One Piece as most pirates seem to believe or havin complete freedom of roaming the sea, as Luffy believes. Either way, the only way that can happen is power. One must be insanely powerful to become a pirate king.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Garp and Roger appeared to be two powerful people who had been crushing over numerous times, or rather, as what it was said, Garp had cornered Roger many times.

Perhaps that was why Garp wanted to capture Roger personally. If he had been trying so many times and failed, his pride would definitely get hurt. When Roger was in the jail cell, in that same chapter you had posted, Roger said that they had "faced each other dozens of times in battle" indicating that they fought but Garp couldn't captured him. At the same time, Garp wasn't killed by Roger either. I suspect that both parties might have gotten injured in their numerous battles, but none could bring down each other. Additionally, the two of them seemed to have such unshakeable determination (mentality) with one having "I refused to be captured" and the other with "I must capture him". It seems like "pride" is at work.

At the end of the day, Roger turned himself in due to his personal reason - terminal illness, and he asked Garp a special and exceptional favour.

In the issue of "comrade-ship" - one is a Marine Official and the other is a Pirate. They are not "equal" (or I should say different) in their social status (and norms), at least in terms of their occupation and the position they each were holding. However I do not sense their hostility towards each other. Garp seems to be a person who has a "passionate" heart. When I say this, I mean that he is not a Marine soldier who would kill just because the other person is a criminal/pirate.

Both seemed to respect each other. Perhaps due to their numerous clashes, they might feel the closeness to each other. For Roger to ask that "favour", he must have trusted Garp fully as he knew his wives and children would be killed. If he had made the wrong decision and misjudged Garp, Ace would not be born. One of the cruelest things to do is to kill a baby while he/she is still in the mother womb. Both mother and child die.

For this reason, that was why Roger thought of Garp like his crewmate, one whom he could trust and entrust his final bloodline to.

I do not think it is so much of outward standing, but more to the emotional impact that influences their relationship.

One translation says Garp and Roger nearly killed each other many times.

All other translations including the VIZ never state that they nearly killed the other many times, but that they just fought often.

Based on the former translation, many believe that Garp and Roger were equals which couldn't be true being that the only person to have fought equally with Roger was Whitebeard as Buggy stated which implies, the "almost kill each other" translation must be the wrong translation.

Even if Roger didn't kill Garp or vice versa, we know that killing is seldom the conclusion to battles, it's usually that one ends up incapacitated. Garp wanting to capture Roger implies he was never able to capture him. I don't think it would be any different, the relationship between Luffy and Smoker, Luffy is much stronger than Smoker as we can all tell now, but Luffy does trust smoker and this is likely the relationship between Garp and Roger, enemies with mutual respect for the other.

Roger being a Pirate, evading capture is a given, and a part of the journey; Garp being a Marine, it's a personal goal just like Smoker and Coby have sworn to be Luffy's captors; Garp and Roger also being enemies, share mutual respect for the other just like Luffy mutually respects Coby and Smoker despite being enemies. If they've fought many times, we can conclude that Roger always came up the victor and managed to escape, Sengoku also makes this remark when Shiki challenged Roger.

However, when it comes to strength, the translation which claims they were equals is incorrect, they just encountered the other often, but it seems quite clear that Roger was indeed superior in light of Whitebeard being stated by Buggy, as the only one to ever stalemate Roger, and Roger also never being caught points to this as I doubt luck and storms were always present to turn the tides. I'm pretty sure that Buggy would have witnessed the fights between Roger, Whitebeard and Garp.

I read somewhere that Garp only got the Hero title because he was made to take credit for Roger's capture. If we rewind to the past, Rayleigh tells us that the Marines took credit for capturing Roger as a show of strength, what better way to make this seem all the more authentic by crediting this feat to Garp, thus getting the epithet as "the hero". It wouldn't be that surprising being that, the Marines are notorious for claiming credit for the work of Pirates if it boosts their image as seen in Alabasta arc, and Dressrosa arc.

It is indeed very cruel killing so many pregnant women just because they might have been related to Roger, to think Sengoku would actually have approved of such an act (well, probably had to due to Gorosei and Tenryuubito), it does show how evil and brainwashed the Marines are when they go to such lengths.

 

[Fox666]

This is a good reading, but it's also too convoluted.

There is a lot of talk about the Pirate King being the strongest man alive, but that's not true. Given the recent reveal of the Road Poneglyphs, everything is much clearer now. The Pirate King doesn't need to be the strongest man alive, he only need to find Raftel. Usopp said it loud that Luffy would become the Pirate King after incorrectly assuming that single Road Poneglyph had the location of Raftel. On the other hand, Whitebeard was know as the strongest man alive for decades, and he never became the Pirate King.

In order to find the four Road Poneglyph and reach Raftel, it's very likelysomeone will fight the strongest pirates or marines on the way. That's what everybody meant when they said the Pirate King has to be the strongest, but it's not absolute necessary.

It does raise the question of why reaching Raftel would make someone the Pirate King. They said Roger "conquered the Grand Line", which made him king. But we know Roger wanted freedom, not responsibilities, so it's safe to assume he did not claimed the Grand Line his territory like the Yonko. A simple explanation is that Roger conquered the Grand Line in the same sense of conquering a mountain when reaching it's pinnacle, which is Raftel.

The biggest question is why the entire world recognized Roger as the Pirate King, since nobody knows anything about the Road Poneglyphs or Raftel. Did Roger came out with something from there, which the general population of One Piece knows, but not the reader?

If we also go back, we know that there appears to be only 2 Emperors during that period; Whitebeard being extremely powerful, and Shiki with the biggest fleet in the New World, clearly they were most influential Pirates in their era, and that is the exact definition of an Emperor or Yonko as Garp says⁽⁴³²⁾.

As Garp explained, the Yonko are pirates who rule over the New World like emperors. If neither Whitebeard of Shiki did that back then, which we have no confirmation of, they were not Emperors.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Given the recent reveal of the Road Poneglyphs, everything is much clearer now. The Pirate King doesn't need to be the strongest man alive, he only need to find Raftel.

I'm sorry, but that's just not correct.

Do you know how one finds out the name Raftel? It's not something spread by rumours, it's something that's only learnt on reaching the Island that the Log Poses all point to, or reading the Poneglyph which Robin discovered at Skypiea I believe.

Even when Crocus mentioned Raftel, do you know he actually never said Raftel is Island at the end of the Log Pose? He said that it's the FINAL Island to reach (not the Island at the end of the Log Pose), and we find out that's true because one has to reach the Island at end of Log-pose before being able to reach Raftel, had to digress a bit just to point that out.

That implies that Raftel is not something widely known about, save those who can read the Poneglyphs (which is why the SHs don't need to go to the Island at end of Log Pose), Roger's closest crew mates and the Emperors.

People do not know that Raftel exists, so how can people claim Roger Pirate King for accomplishing a feat that they can't verify? It's like Luffy saying he's Pirate King because he reached Skypiea, who would believe him? It'd be questioned.

As, Luffy himself said, Pirate King must defeat the Yonko and Admirals in order to obtain the title. The only reason One Piece or Raftel leads to being called Pirate King is because one has to defeat these guys. Without the obstacle, One Piece or Raftel would have no relevance in becoming Pirate King.

Finally, last point, IF (One PIECE/RAFTEL = PIRATE KING)

• People question the authenticity of One Piece, and its existence. Then, why don't people question the authenticity of Roger being Pirate King?

There's a discrepancy, hinting or showing rather, that One Piece/Raftel and the Pirate King are not explicitly connected.

People do not have a clue where Roger had been, all they know is he fought and Roger was notorious for this which is why he's widely hated, that's the only piece of information that the world can be aware of (just like Aokiji and Akainu's battle), but his journey and whereabouts? No, the world has no clue he went to Raftel, much less, Skypiea or even Wano.

Sengoku was happy to call Roger Pirate King, even Joker who didn't believe in One Piece (advocating the age of dreams is over via Bellamy) he still recognized Roger as Pirate King. If Pirate means one has found One Piece/Raftel, why is he then angry that Whitebeard claimed One Piece exists? It's because they're not explicitly related. Roger at his execution was asked if One Piece exists, wouldn't that be tantamount to asking are you Pirate King if they were that closely related?

What makes One Piece capable of making one Pirate King is the fact that everyone wants it, and of course, that means that only the strongest will find it as it's a battle royal if you will, a contention between all Pirates, so of course, the victor will be Pirate King.

Sengoku happily said Ace was potentially the next Pirate King, but as soon as he hears One Piece, it's a different story. There's a detachment with One Piece/Raftel and being Pirate King, at the same time a connection, but it doesn't explicitly make one Pirate King.

Almost forgot, but Emperors are people who have the greatest influence in the sea. Shiki had the greatest fleet, there's no doubt he'd be considered an Emperor; Whitebeard was the only one to equal Roger, he most definitely was an Emperor too. There's a reason the influence in the New World is shared by Pirates and not the WG.

Joker even tells that the seas (New World) since Whitebeard's death is now in chaos because there's no one ruling it since Roger, and Whitebeard who roled before the throne. Who does he suggest could take control of it? The Yonko, the Supernova; the RA were also included, and so were the Marines. If Marines do not rule it, then it leaves us with Pirates ruling it implying Emperors would have existed even if not being called by that name.

 

[M3J]

Wasn't it said or implied that Whitebeard never became the pirate king because he chose not to be? If I recall, that was in one of Whitebeard's flashback during the Marineford War, either when he was talking to crewmate before he formed his own crew or when he was talking to Roger. He cared more about forming a family and being with them, otherwise I'm sure he could have easily been the pirate king, especially if Whitebeard era lasted for over a decade.

I guess the pirate king is also someone who declares himself as one. If Roger declared himself pirate king, but Whitebeard never did, then that could be why, especially if it's known Roger reached Raftel. Didn't he plant the One Piece treasure in Raftel or something?

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

Wasn't it said or implied that Whitebeard never became the pirate king because he chose not to be? If I recall, that was in one of Whitebeard's flashback during the Marineford War, either when he was talking to crewmate before he formed his own crew or when he was talking to Roger. He cared more about forming a family and being with them, otherwise I'm sure he could have easily been the pirate king, especially if Whitebeard era lasted for over a decade.

I guess the pirate king is also someone who declares himself as one. If Roger declared himself pirate king, but Whitebeard never did, then that could be why, especially if it's known Roger reached Raftel. Didn't he plant the One Piece treasure in Raftel or something?

After Roger became Pirate King, he visited Whitebeard and told him about the One Piece, Will of D, Raftel and everything related to the Poneglyphs.

Roger dies, 2 years later, Shiki escapes from Prison and lets us all know, that this age belongs to Whitebeard because Roger is no longer an obstacle; this means Whitebeard was initially aiming to becoming Pirate King while Roger was alive, most likely until Roger told him about the WIll of D and One Piece.

22 years have gone, Whitebeard has been stated by both Akainu and Whitebeard to have ruled before the throne, although, never becoming it's king, why? It must have something to do with what Roger said.

After learning about the Will of D, he takes the son of his enemy whom he knows is a D, grooms him to be Pirate King and genuinely loves him as a son despite being related to his arch-rival; something had to have changed for him to have lost his ambition and been rather stale for 22 years, Blackbeard also makes similar remarks to Whitebeard concerning this.

He could definitely have become Pirate King, but chose not to.

Reason Whitebeard was never known as Pirate King is because he never defeated all Yonko which is the main prerequisite to be Pirate King. He defeated Kaido, Bigmam, but never fought Shank which means he didn't fulfil the requirements necessary to be crowned King.

 

[M3J]

Was there Yonkou during Roger's time? Shiki's statement doesn't necessarily mean Roger was an obstacle for Whitebeard, it could mean that after Jolly Roger pirates broke up, there was no one tough or good enough to go against Whitebeard. I see Whitebeard as not caring as much about becoming the pirate king as he did about his crew, whom he considered like his sons. Could also be that he never thought himself as worthy as Roger.

 

[Fox666]

People do not know that Raftel exists, so how can people claim Roger Pirate King for accomplishing a feat that they can't verify? It's like Luffy saying he's Pirate King because he reached Skypiea, who would believe him? It'd be questioned.

Good point. But Usopp did said that if Luffy reaches the final island of the Grand Line, he would be Pirake King:

The only explanation I could give is that by reaching the final island, Roger conquered the Grand Line. The pirates of New World spread the world, and the entire world knew Roger conquered the Grand Line, even without knowing how.

As, Luffy himself said, Pirate King must defeat the Yonko and Admirals in order to obtain the title. The only reason One Piece or Raftel leads to being called Pirate King is because one has to defeat these guys. Without the obstacle, One Piece or Raftel would have no relevance in becoming Pirate King.

Saying that in order to become the Pirate King you have to be the strong is like that in order to win a race, you must be the fastest runner. In reality, you only have to reach the finish line first. You could win because you used a shortcut, another competitor broke his knee, etc. The same goes to becoming the Pirate King, the finish line is Raftel.

Almost forgot, but Emperors are people who have the greatest influence in the sea. Shiki had the greatest fleet, there's no doubt he'd be considered an Emperor; Whitebeard was the only one to equal Roger, he most definitely was an Emperor too. There's a reason the influence in the New World is shared by Pirates and not the WG.

Joker even tells that the seas (New World) since Whitebeard's death is now in chaos because there's no one ruling it since Roger, and Whitebeard who roled before the throne. Who does he suggest could take control of it? The Yonko, the Supernova; the RA were also included, and so were the Marines. If Marines do not rule it, then it leaves us with Pirates ruling it implying Emperors would have existed even if not being called by that name.

Doflamingo said there was no one ruling as the Pirate King. Whitebeard was #1 of the pirates, he was anything but the Pirate King. I don't think that's related to the role of the Yonko.

The Yonko rule like emperors, claiming islands of the New World as theirs. Blackbeard became a Yonko because he defeated the Whitebeard Pirates and took over their territory. Otherwise he would be just a incredibly powerfull pirates, like it was the case of Roger before becoming Pirate King. Unless there is any confirmation regarding Shiki, he was not a Yonko.

Also, Garp said the Marine and Shichibukai exist to counterbalance the Yonko. Since it appears the Shichibukai didn't always existed, doesn't that imply that neither did the Yonko?