American Politics

[xi0]

Elon Musk slams billionaire tax: 'Eventually, they run out of other people’s money and then they come for you'

Elon Musk is among those finding fault with a proposed annual tax on billionaires’ unrealized capital gains from Democratic lawmakers, with the world's...

www.marketwatch.com

I wonder if this is just a ploy to engage his delusional sycophants or if he's really this delusional himself? Surely with how much of a genius he is, it'd have to be the former right?

Does Musk own a business that doesn't run off of government subsidies?

 

[kkck]

I am sort of with musk on that one. Though not because "then they are coming for you". I mean, that's kinda the point, that people pay them. The article talks about taxing unrealized capital gains... Which sounds like lunacy. Because that's not yet cash anyone has received. If they sell something and net a profit then sure, tax it. But... if you tax something which hasn't actually generated cash flow.... You basically force them to sell stuff to pay for said tax. Tax companies 40% of their profit, have the highest tax bracket of income tax be 40~%... but focus on income, not unrealized money or assets.

 

[xi0]

You basically force them to sell stuff to pay for said tax

As opposed to them not paying taxes at all?

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 27, 2021, Original Post Date: Oct 27, 2021 ---

It's clearly a response to these 700 or so individuals acting like they have no income.

The "worry" of this extending to the middle class at some point is akin to my worry about the sun running out of hydrogen

 

[kkck]

As opposed to them not paying taxes at all?

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 27, 2021, Original Post Date: Oct 27, 2021 ---

It's clearly a response to these 700 or so individuals acting like they have no income.

The "worry" of this extending to the middle class at some point is akin to my worry about the sun running out of hydrogen

Welp, the issue here is ultimately that the system is broken... But you won't fix this by implementing nonsense. It's not like putting this in place will somehow lead to reasonable tax policy along the way or convince them to not use their armies of lawyers and accountants to take advantage of every loophole in the system (not that the system should work on the honor system). Obviously the worry of this extending to the middle class is beyond absurd. The idea that the middle class has unrealized capital gains shows musk's mind has traveled further from earth than his finest rocket by a few lightyears...

 

[xi0]

Welp, the issue here is ultimately that the system is broken... But you won't fix this by implementing nonsense. It's not like putting this in place will somehow lead to reasonable tax policy along the way or convince them to not use their armies of lawyers and accountants to take advantage of every loophole in the system (not that the system should work on the honor system). Obviously the worry of this extending to the middle class is beyond absurd. The idea that the middle class has unrealized capital gains shows musk's mind has traveled further from earth than his finest rocket by a few lightyears...

Agreed, but the tax system being broken or not simple enough isn't going to stop the extremely wealthy from finding loopholes like this though. Imagine thinking someone like Musk should be paying more than a theoretical 3% is somehow "divisive".

 

[Sanity Check]

Does Musk own a business that doesn't run off of government subsidies?

Space X relied on subsidies from NASA.

I seem to remember reading Trump canceled tax credits for electric cars.

A very stereotypical and predictable move given the republican parties history of being in bed with big oil and saudis.

 

[xi0]

Space X relied on subsidies from NASA.

I seem to remember reading Trump canceled tax credits for electric cars.

A very stereotypical and predictable move given the republican parties history of being in bed with big oil and saudis.

Pretty sure they still do. Tesla survived the Great Recession in part due to the loan they got from the government. SolarCity too.

At first the Boring Company gave me pause, but of course any tunnels they have/will build would be from bids from the government. The same sort of deal with Neuralink when/if it gets off the ground.

The point is Elon Musk knows where his bread is buttered, so these kind of antics are the most cynical nonsense anyone could see.

 

[M3J]

Elon Musk slams billionaire tax: 'Eventually, they run out of other people’s money and then they come for you'

Elon Musk is among those finding fault with a proposed annual tax on billionaires’ unrealized capital gains from Democratic lawmakers, with the world's...

www.marketwatch.com

I wonder if this is just a ploy to engage his delusional sycophants or if he's really this delusional himself? Surely with how much of a genius he is, it'd have to be the former right?

Does Musk own a business that doesn't run off of government subsidies?

I think the former and to look smarter/better? I mean, dude has a cult following as it is, and it wouldn't hurt to make them be even more against billionaire taxes and think of him as an iconic and innovative good person.

 

[Sanity Check]

The point is Elon Musk knows where his bread is buttered, so these kind of antics are the most cynical nonsense anyone could see.

Governments are usually anti progress.

Which naturally puts them in conflict with anyone who wants to improve the status quo.

 

[kkck]

So the government grants which indubitably helped musk were anti progress?

 

[Sanity Check]

So the government grants which indubitably helped musk were anti progress?

Government is anti progress.

If you remember I said this in 5 to 10 years.

You'll know with 100% accuracy its true.

I would bet my life on it.

None of you would bet against me.

 

[ninjabot]

Bet what exactly? That the government is anti progress? How would you even begin to determine that? That’s a subjective judgement. Your idea of progression won’t be the same as ours by any stretch of the imagination. We consider moving left to be progress. Most of us at least. You consider moving right to be superior.

If the government continues to cater to society’s gradual move left you’ll simply complain that the government is failing to keep the “woke mob” in check and view that as confirmation of your suspicions. Why the hell would we care that you saw that coming when WE’RE the ones pushing for that future to come true? If I order a steak at a restaurant and you say “I bet ninjabot is gonna have steak for dinner-ttebayo!”, the only logical response is “Duh. So what?”

 

[Sanity Check]

That the government is anti progress? How would you even begin to determine that?

How can people determine that?

The same way russia rejected socialism and the USSR.

...

 

[ninjabot]

Again: subjective judgements. Besides, government is just a method used to regulate society. In some cases it’s needed to step in and prevent anarchy. In other cases it’s used to help people solve problems addressing society. And in other ways it’s used to help make society better.

The only reason people claim government is here to stop progression, is because they dislike the direction in which it’s progressing. In other words: subjective opinions like I said. So your bets are worthless o anyone but you.

 

[xi0]

Government is anti progress.

What does progress look like to you?

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 29, 2021, Original Post Date: Oct 29, 2021 ---

Because to be fair, you were the one championing SpaceX as some sort of capitalistic triumph and calling NASA "socialism"

 

[M3J]

I mean, other than restoring protections for LGBT+ people, the Biden Administration hasn't been that progressive either. no medicare for all, increased minimum wage, cancelling student loan, or continuing financial assistance due to covid.

 

[ninjabot]

Yeah, I agree. But that's not a rebuking of government in general. That's a rebuking of the Biden administration (which I agree with).

I just find it's usually the right-wing that are all "No big government! Government is bad!" mindset. And I'm saying, it isn't perfect, but it's necessary, and it helps.

Lately I've come to the conclusion the only reason folks tend to be anti government is because they don't want anyone to have the power to regulate their behavior. It's how you end up with some states of the country that are stuck generations behind others when it comes to things like social justice, literacy, acceptance of science, and the like.

 

[M3J]

I used BIden as a recent example, but otherwise I can't think of when the government was progressive, other than FDR and Teddy Roosevelt.

THe right wing are full of contradictions though. They oppose government and it interfering in everything but will try to get the government to ban abortion and anything else they don't like, like immigration. It's really about what they think will benefit them or their horseshit views.

 

[kkck]

And... biden's approval keeps tanking. He is pretty much at trump levels of approval... You'd think by now he would have change his tactic of immediately caving on his campaign promises and actually try to stand for something.

 

[ninjabot]

And... biden's approval keeps tanking. He is pretty much at trump levels of approval... You'd think by now he would have change his tactic of immediately caving on his campaign promises and actually try to stand for something.

Yep. If there's one good thing about all this though it's the fact that we're holding him to a higher standard than the Right were willing to hold Trump to. Biden doesn't have a cult explaining away his fuck ups. We're all calling him on his bullshit.

Hopefully this leads to action.