Discussion Haki Thread

[Brandish μ]

For all ongoing Haki discussion, please post here.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

That makes no sense whatsoever, at least according to the translations we have.

Those are the two available translations, barring the crunchy role ones assuming that one is out. Just look at how that goes. He talks about how one can have power flow into the blade. That power is used to make it so that the blade cuts or doesn't cut depending on what the user wants. And then he speaks about him learning goken. Why even bring up the sword thing if it doesn't relate to haki? It'd be something completely random that has brings nothing to the conversation he is having. At a minimum the translations mean to make the point that the sword thing is haki based.

You'll notice that his comment about Goken is different from when he's talking about BOAT.

He's relating BOAT (cut/not cut) "to will of swordsmen" not Haki. He knows what Haki is and other people that aren't swordsmen can use Haki.
The same does not apply to BOAT. It is strictly a technique for swordsmen only.

You can't throw a punch and will it to hurt or not hurt. In fact Haki will only make it hurt more.
Similarly
You can't throw a kick and will it to hurt or not hurt someone. It essentially does that and Haki makes it worse.

However with the sword technique BOAT.
You can will it to cut or not cut, hurt or not hurt. It's not related to Haki at all.

For those who speculate Komurasaki isn't dead. It's possible Kyoshiro used a technique similar to BOAT or even BOAT itself to make the act successful.

 

[nik87]

However with the sword technique BOAT.
You can will it to cut or not cut, hurt or not hurt. It's not related to Haki at all.

But BOAT is about hearing the breath of all things. Zoro is just standing and hearing, cutting steel came later. How is hearing allowing cutting?
There is no reason why non-swordsmen cant hear the breath of all things but how will they use it if that ability is what you think it is?

Edit: @AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA I know that but still my two questions stand. I am not buying that since it makes no sense for now.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

But BOAT is about hearing the breath of all things. Zoro is just standing and hearing, cutting steel came later. How is hearing allowing cutting?
There is no reason why non-swordsmen cant hear the breath of all things but how will they use it if that ability is what you think it is?

That was Zoro's conclusion on the technique. Something along the line of the ability to cut/not cut is the ability to hear the breathing. He then proceeded to cutting Mr one.

HP posted that panel recently I believe.

Edit:
Found it!

Screenshot_2019-04-25-23-54-57.png

• AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA
• Apr 25, 2019

BOAT: The ability to cut/not cut in Zoro's own wordings

 

[kkck]

You'll notice that his comment about Goken is different from when he's talking about BOAT.

He's relating BOAT (cut/not cut) "to will of swordsmen" not Haki. He knows what Haki is and other people that aren't swordsmen can use Haki.
The same does not apply to BOAT. It is strictly a technique for swordsmen only.

You can't throw a punch and will it to hurt or not hurt. In fact Haki will only make it hurt more.
Similarly
You can't throw a kick and will it to hurt or not hurt someone. It essentially does that and Haki makes it worse.

However with the sword technique BOAT.
You can will it to cut or not cut, hurt or not hurt. It's not related to Haki at all.

For those who speculate Komurasaki isn't dead. It's possible Kyoshiro used a technique similar to BOAT or even BOAT itself to make the act successful.

I simply don't agree with your interpretation of things here. It makes precisely zero sense to me. Its all part of one explanation unless what you are suggesting is that mid explanation the old man just rambled incoherently for a bit and then went back on topic. The bit about cutting clearly ties into his overall haki explanation. Otherwise this is equivalent to him starting his explanation about haki, then for a moment talk about how to bake a cake, and then he goes back to the explanation.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

unless what you are suggesting is that mid explanation the old man just rambled incoherently for a bit and then went back on topic.

Seems that way at first but it seems the technique of BOAT has some relation with the Goken technique. Hence his diversion.

In BOAT, there's this bit of willing your sword to cut.
In Goken, it's willing your Haki to flow.

Don't know if you see the correlation.
Cos in the last chapters Hyogoro brought it up.
I don't think he talked about it initially just to ramble incoherently. It's related to the Goken technique he's trying to teach Luffy.

 

[kkck]

Seems that way at first but it seems the technique of BOAT has some relation with the Goken technique. Hence his diversion.

In BOAT, there's this bit of willing your sword to cut.
In Goken, it's willing your Haki to flow.

Don't know if you see the correlation.
Cos in the last chapters Hyogoro brought it up.
I don't think he talked about it initially just to ramble incoherently. It's related to the Goken technique he's trying to teach Luffy.

If its related to the goken technique then its 110% haki.

 

[Hrathgrath]

You'll notice that his comment about Goken is different from when he's talking about BOAT.

He's relating BOAT (cut/not cut) "to will of swordsmen" not Haki. He knows what Haki is and other people that aren't swordsmen can use Haki.
The same does not apply to BOAT. It is strictly a technique for swordsmen only.

You can't throw a punch and will it to hurt or not hurt. In fact Haki will only make it hurt more.
Similarly
You can't throw a kick and will it to hurt or not hurt someone. It essentially does that and Haki makes it worse.

However with the sword technique BOAT.
You can will it to cut or not cut, hurt or not hurt. It's not related to Haki at all.

For those who speculate Komurasaki isn't dead. It's possible Kyoshiro used a technique similar to BOAT or even BOAT itself to make the act successful.

You still didn't answer the question. Why would he mention that technique at all? If it has nothing to do with Haki he may as well be having two different conversations. Honestly I don't see how you and HP get that he ISN'T talking about haki. No offence of course.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 26, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 26, 2019 ---

"This word "computer" must be a foreign concept."
"In my country we have skaters that can skate up and down the walls of a pool. They are able to turn while in mid air and fall back to the ground and continue skating!"
"When I was a kid I had something called a "laptop." We could play games and connect with people through something we call the "internet". I think I can teach you how to use the internet!"

See how that doesn't make sense as a conversation?

 

[Deleted member 169696]

You still didn't answer the question. Why would he mention that technique at all? If it has nothing to do with Haki he may as well be having two different conversations. Honestly I don't see how you and HP get that he ISN'T talking about haki. No offence of course.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 26, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 26, 2019 ---

"This word "computer" must be a foreign concept."
"In my country we have skaters that can skate up and down the walls of a pool. They are able to turn while in mid air and fall back to the ground and continue skating!"
"When I was a kid I had something called a "laptop." We could play games and connect with people through something we call the "internet". I think I can teach you how to use the internet!"

See how that doesn't make sense as a conversation?

Dude, that last paragraph gave me some good laughs !!!

 

[M3J]

Yep I could see it working in a way that palm attack bypasses the scales to do damage. It would make sense if it's possible.

Just I'm a little skeptical about it, similar to what Hrathgrath is saying, because it's like Luffy wants to break the scales (I assume).

In any case, Luffy figuring this out is a tad tough to swallow lol. I mean he just knows the basics. Not calling him a dummy - I'm calling everyone else who's fought Kaido one.

One downside is that it could make Luffy overpowered if he can use this at will because he can stretch and use the haki thingie to deal internal damage, and with haki not even Marco could be able to keep on tanking it. Wonder how rare this ability is, especially Future Sight, and it'd honestly be kind of annoying if Luffy learned most of different kinds of haki.

But then again, there's only so much Oda can do with rubber, and haki would probably help Luffy be more innovative with his devil fruit. Hopefully. tbh though he needs to focus on his haki stamina, he was pretty lucky against Doflamingo and Katakuri otherwise they'd have killed him easily.

I agree for the most part but one thing I wanted to mention is it’s armament not armor Haki.
Check this out and tell me if you think it makes sense for haki:

Imagine Haki is a persons spirit, or soul, or chi, or “life energy”. And when I say “life-energy” I mean the energy that makes you, you, not literally your life force. I think that’s where the confusion of haki as life energy comes from.

Colour of Armament (Busoshoku): I want to say first that the word ‘Armament’ can be defined as anything used for battle (loose definition).

“Invisible” Haki- taking control of your spirit to solidify(or compress, or condense. Whatever works for you. For the purposes of this explination they are the same thing) it outside of your body as an armor. The stronger your spirit is, the harder you can make your armor. Since this armor is made of your spirit, it can harm an enemy’s spirit directly. Since the spirit and the body are connected, it translates to physical damage upon the receiver of the attack.

Koka, or “Hardening”- focusing your spirit inside your body to reinforce your cells. This makes them harder and more dense. In Luffy’s case this means while his rubber is much harder, it doesn’t change the rubber qualities of his cells/body. Also in Luffy’s case that means it takes more energy to stretch and therefore much more energy is released from the release of that stretching, like a slingshot. *see below for more on this. With practice, your spirit can also be focused into your weapons molecules, reinforcing them and making the weapon stronger. ** see below for more on this

Ashigara Dokkoi- I use this name since it’s the only name that’s been used definitively for this technique. Flooding your body with the energy of your spirit, like filling a container until it’s totally full, and then letting all of that energy flow out of your body through your hand(s). This can be used as either attack, defense, or both simultaneously. And since it is a spirit based attack, it attacks the spirit directly, bypassing defenses, including “natural” devil fruit defenses.

Color of Observation (Kenbunshoku): The ability to sense the spirit, or spirits energy, of everyone (or thing/animals) around you. Depending on the strength of your spirit or your ability to focus that ability to sense, you can sense much more than just where a person is. You can sense in another persons spirit what they intend to do, or if they are being deceptive, or if they have an evil spirit in general. While Zoro said he could “hear” the “breath” of the things around him, I seriously doubt he meant it literally. I think by “breath” he meant their living spirit, and “hearing” I believe he meant sensing it.

Zoom: Focusing your sense of haki in a direction greatly so you can still sense it from a great distance.

“Future Sight”- The ability to sense the intended movements/actions of people and things around you by “reading” their spirit. The more adept you are at this skill the further you can see actions and the consequences of those actions and so on. I’m willing to bet that the “visions” we, as the reader, are shown are just how Oda interprets this since so we can “see” what they sense.

(???) The Voice of All Things: I believe this is an ability that very very few people possess that allows them to communicate with another’s spirit. Probably non-vocally. At least on the users side. I believe this is what Roger could do, and Luffy can do. I think Momo and Shirahoshi also have this ability but likely to a lesser degree. I think Zunisha only responded to him and not Luffy because he was the leader of the Kouzuki, and honor bound to respond.

Colour of Conquerors (Haoshoku)- Using your own spirit to overwhelm the spirit of others. I think it Aworks kinda like this. You send out a massive wave, like the ocean, and if the victims spirit isn’t strong enough it is “knocked over” by the intensity of the Haoshoku user.

Notes:
*Think about the attacks where he pulls/retracts his arm into itself only to have it blast its way forward when he releases that retraction. (I have a theory about him changing directions of the attack in mid air: Either he shows incredible control with his haki to make one side of his arm more dense for a split second thus taking a little longer to stretch than the other side, pulling it in another direction, OR he releases the density entirely for a split second on the entire arm, making it move much faster for a split second and causing his arm to rebound against the air like Geppo.


Just a working theory of course, but it seems to fit!

welcome back kkck! Was wondering if you'd ever do long posts again

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

You still didn't answer the question. Why would he mention that technique at all?

I already did. Unless you ignored my response to @kkck

If its related to the goken technique then its 110% haki.

That's your headcannon. So far BOAT has had nothing to do with Haki. It's just a skill.

Or should I ask you to show me inferences in the past were BOAT was said to be Haki?

 

[Hrathgrath]

Seems that way at first but it seems the technique of BOAT has some relation with the Goken technique. Hence his diversion.

In BOAT, there's this bit of willing your sword to cut.
In Goken, it's willing your Haki to flow.

Don't know if you see the correlation.
Cos in the last chapters Hyogoro brought it up.
I don't think he talked about it initially just to ramble incoherently. It's related to the Goken technique he's trying to teach Luffy.

I already did. Unless you ignored my response to @kkck



That's your headcannon. So far BOAT has had nothing to do with Haki. It's just a skill.

Or should I ask you to show me inferences in the past were BOAT was said to be Haki?

Sorry, I missed that post! My bad! Having said that, I still don’t see the connection. I get that you are saying that if he mentioned that then there MUST BE a connection, but I think it’s more likely that he was talking about haki the whole time than he was talking about a related skill that he just never brought up before Luffy began trying again.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 26, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 26, 2019 ---

To continue, he either has to elaborate in future chapters on the connection between the other skill (willing to cut) for what you are saying to work, because he just hasn’t yet. Entirely possible, sure. But I personally find it much more likely that he was talking about haki the entire time because he apparently ended his explanation when Luffy began trying again. Not saying he won’t elaborate further, I just don’t think it will be about “willingness to cut”.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Sorry, I missed that post! My bad! Having said that, I still don’t see the connection. I get that you are saying that if he mentioned that then there MUST BE a connection, but I think it’s more likely that he was talking about haki the whole time than he was talking about a related skill that he just never brought up before Luffy began trying again.

I've looked at that possibility and after going through past inferences and sourcing out if there's any relation of Haki to BOAT, I ditched it. It's not in the writer's style to just bring up stuff for the sake of it and Haki wasn't even in place as far as back then.
Then there's the fact that Hyogoro was a very powerful swordsman and swordsmanship has nothing to do with hand to hand combat. Yet, he knows a technique meant for hand to hand combatants/brawlers.

In his conversation box. Hyogoro mentions the hardening we've seen swordsmen use (imbuing Haki to their weapon) which involves Haki. He then talks about the will of the swordsman – Something Luffy isn't.
Either Hyogoro is showing off his vast knowledge of the sword or he's relating a sword technique to a hand technique and there's no doubt Hyogoro can do without his sword just like Rayleigh, expecting Luffy to learn something.
Clearly, the knowledge of the sword is no good to Luffy. If it were Zoro here then we know he'll pick it up faster.

Plus, Hyogoro doesn't know Luffy isn't a swordsman. In fact he gives off the persona of one (can't blame old Hyo here). Moreover majority of the powerful warriors in Wano are expected to be swordsmen.
Hyo also mentioned he heard of Luffy's defeat in Kuri and if you recall well, Luffy was mentioned as a Samurai in the Wano newspaper.

IMG_20190426_122936.jpg

• AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA
• Apr 26, 2019

LoL – Luffy a Samurai?

Hyo most likely heard the rumours and now he's witnessing Luffy in the flesh.
Since they aren't allowed any weapons in the execution ground Hyo still wouldn't know Luffy isn't a Samurai at all.
And Luffy hasn't really beaten anyone (Luffy style), he hasn't used his Gomu techniques and he's either evading or trying to achieve the Goken technique so far in this arena.
Also Hyo might just see him as a powerful Samurai like himself and Rayleigh who are still very formidable without their weapon.

Now it all makes sense that Hyo would talk about sword techniques to Luffy. In his eyes, it's Zoro without swords trying to improvise.

 

[Hrathgrath]

I've looked at that possibility and after going through past inferences and sourcing out if there's any relation of Haki to BOAT, I ditched it. It's not in the writer's style to just bring up stuff for the sake of it and Haki wasn't even in place as far as back then.
Then there's the fact that Hyogoro was a very powerful swordsman and swordsmanship has nothing to do with hand to hand combat. Yet, he knows a technique meant for hand to hand combatants/brawlers.

In his conversation box. Hyogoro mentions the hardening we've seen swordsmen use (imbuing Haki to their weapon) which involves Haki. He then talks about the will of the swordsman – Something Luffy isn't.
Either Hyogoro is showing off his vast knowledge of the sword or he's relating a sword technique to a hand technique and there's no doubt Hyogoro can do without his sword just like Rayleigh, expecting Luffy to learn something.
Clearly, the knowledge of the sword is no good to Luffy. If it were Zoro here then we know he'll pick it up faster.

Plus, Hyogoro doesn't know Luffy isn't a swordsman. In fact he gives off the persona of one (can't blame old Hyo here). Moreover majority of the powerful warriors in Wano are expected to be swordsmen.
Hyo also mentioned he heard of Luffy's defeat in Kuri and if you recall well, Luffy was mentioned as a Samurai in the Wano newspaper.

IMG_20190426_122936.jpg

• AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA
• Apr 26, 2019

LoL – Luffy a Samurai?

Hyo most likely heard the rumours and now he's witnessing Luffy in the flesh.
Since they aren't allowed any weapons in the execution ground Hyo still wouldn't know Luffy isn't a Samurai at all.
And Luffy hasn't really beaten anyone (Luffy style), he hasn't used his Gomu techniques and he's either evading or trying to achieve the Goken technique so far in this arena.
Also Hyo might just see him as a powerful Samurai like himself and Rayleigh who are still very formidable without their weapon.

Now it all makes sense that Hyo would talk about sword techniques to Luffy. In his eyes, it's Zoro without swords trying to improvise.

Fair point. Still doesn’t work in the point of conversation though. If he was going to bring it up at all, he should have also explained the connection to the technique he is trying to teach Luffy. Also, “a power a swordsman can summon from his body and put into his blade” I’m paraphrasing but either way, that sounds like haki, no? The only way it makes sense if he wasn’t talking about haki when referring to the “will to cut” is if he wasn’t talking about haki when he brought up the “power from the body”.
In the end, I think trying to say that he was interjecting mid-thought about something unrelated to his initial comment is a big stretch. No pun intended.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 26, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 26, 2019 ---

And while haki was not fleshed out earlier in the manga I’m thinking Oda is using this whole training thing to tie them together, wether that was his initial intention or not.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 26, 2019 ---

I agree for the most part but one thing I wanted to mention is it’s armament not armor Haki.
Check this out and tell me if you think it makes sense for haki:

Imagine Haki is a persons spirit, or soul, or chi, or “life energy”. And when I say “life-energy” I mean the energy that makes you, you, not literally your life force. I think that’s where the confusion of haki as life energy comes from.

Colour of Armament (Busoshoku): I want to say first that the word ‘Armament’ can be defined as anything used for battle (loose definition).

“Invisible” Haki- taking control of your spirit to solidify(or compress, or condense. Whatever works for you. For the purposes of this explination they are the same thing) it outside of your body as an armor. The stronger your spirit is, the harder you can make your armor. Since this armor is made of your spirit, it can harm an enemy’s spirit directly. Since the spirit and the body are connected, it translates to physical damage upon the receiver of the attack.

Koka, or “Hardening”- focusing your spirit inside your body to reinforce your cells. This makes them harder and more dense. In Luffy’s case this means while his rubber is much harder, it doesn’t change the rubber qualities of his cells/body. Also in Luffy’s case that means it takes more energy to stretch and therefore much more energy is released from the release of that stretching, like a slingshot. *see below for more on this. With practice, your spirit can also be focused into your weapons molecules, reinforcing them and making the weapon stronger. ** see below for more on this

Ashigara Dokkoi- I use this name since it’s the only name that’s been used definitively for this technique. Flooding your body with the energy of your spirit, like filling a container until it’s totally full, and then letting all of that energy flow out of your body through your hand(s). This can be used as either attack, defense, or both simultaneously. And since it is a spirit based attack, it attacks the spirit directly, bypassing defenses, including “natural” devil fruit defenses.

Color of Observation (Kenbunshoku): The ability to sense the spirit, or spirits energy, of everyone (or thing/animals) around you. Depending on the strength of your spirit or your ability to focus that ability to sense, you can sense much more than just where a person is. You can sense in another persons spirit what they intend to do, or if they are being deceptive, or if they have an evil spirit in general. While Zoro said he could “hear” the “breath” of the things around him, I seriously doubt he meant it literally. I think by “breath” he meant their living spirit, and “hearing” I believe he meant sensing it.

Zoom: Focusing your sense of haki in a direction greatly so you can still sense it from a great distance.

“Future Sight”- The ability to sense the intended movements/actions of people and things around you by “reading” their spirit. The more adept you are at this skill the further you can see actions and the consequences of those actions and so on. I’m willing to bet that the “visions” we, as the reader, are shown are just how Oda interprets this since so we can “see” what they sense.

(???) The Voice of All Things: I believe this is an ability that very very few people possess that allows them to communicate with another’s spirit. Probably non-vocally. At least on the users side. I believe this is what Roger could do, and Luffy can do. I think Momo and Shirahoshi also have this ability but likely to a lesser degree. I think Zunisha only responded to him and not Luffy because he was the leader of the Kouzuki, and honor bound to respond.

Colour of Conquerors (Haoshoku)- Using your own spirit to overwhelm the spirit of others. I think it Aworks kinda like this. You send out a massive wave, like the ocean, and if the victims spirit isn’t strong enough it is “knocked over” by the intensity of the Haoshoku user.

Notes:
*Think about the attacks where he pulls/retracts his arm into itself only to have it blast its way forward when he releases that retraction. (I have a theory about him changing directions of the attack in mid air: Either he shows incredible control with his haki to make one side of his arm more dense for a split second thus taking a little longer to stretch than the other side, pulling it in another direction, OR he releases the density entirely for a split second on the entire arm, making it move much faster for a split second and causing his arm to rebound against the air like Geppo.


Just a working theory of course, but it seems to fit!

Was looking over my old post and realized I never put in my second note about “Hardening” in reference to weapons. So....:
** Note #2- When you use your spirit to reinforce, or condense, the molecules of your weapon. If this is done so much over a very long period it has a permanent effect on the molecules of the weapon, permanently putting them into that hardened state. While it will still be exceptionally hard, it is no longer infused with haki and thus can’t harm a targets spirit. To clarify it won’t be able to bypass a fruit users defense. It will be VERY hard (no jokes please.) but not haki infused. I think this “hardness” is what makes it “black”.

 

[kkck]

That's your headcannon. So far BOAT has had nothing to do with Haki. It's just a skill.

Or should I ask you to show me inferences in the past were BOAT was said to be Haki?

It's not my headcannon. At worst its hyogoro's head cannon. Obviously there are no instances in the past where it was said BOAT things is haki, we were just told about that now. i don't think you are serious anymore.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

** Note #2- When you use your spirit to reinforce, or condense, the molecules of your weapon. If this is done so much over a very long period it has a permanent effect on the molecules of the weapon, permanently putting them into that hardened state. While it will still be exceptionally hard, it is no longer infused with haki and thus can’t harm a targets spirit. To clarify it won’t be able to bypass a fruit users defense. It will be VERY hard (no jokes please.) but not haki infused. I think this “hardness” is what makes it “black”.

No science please. Stop making things more complex than they already are.

And what are you getting at here?
Are you talking about black blades or just any weapon infused with Haki?

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 26, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 26, 2019 ---

Obviously there are no instances in the past where it was said BOAT things is haki, we were just told about that now.

Then humour me...
Show me one panel where it's specifically said that BOAT IS HAKI.

Cos if you are grabbing at what Hyo said, it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

 

[kkck]

Then humour me...
Show me one panel where it's specifically said that BOAT IS HAKI.

Cos if you are grabbing at what Hyo said, it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

The hyogoru explanation. Thats all we need, its fairly clear about that. Otherwise the discussion is not about haki anymore but rather about sentences, how they work and their basic structure.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

The hyogoru explanation. Thats all we need, its fairly clear about that. Otherwise the discussion is not about haki anymore but rather about sentences, how they work and their basic structure.

And I'm telling you Hyogoro's explanation is very ambiguous. It's multifaceted thus can be interpreted in multiple ways.

I'm standing by mine and others by theirs.
If we are not going to accept either's opinion then it's agree to disagree for now. Until things get clearer. And I trust on Oda to deliver.
One way or another, we are getting to the bottom of this.

 

[kkck]

And I'm telling you Hyogoro's explanation is very ambiguous. It's multifaceted thus can be interpreted in multiple ways.

I'm standing by mine and others by theirs.
If we are not going to accept either's opinion then it's agree to disagree for now. Until things get clearer. And I trust on Oda to deliver.
One way or another, we are getting to the bottom of this.

It's not that ambiguous unless the translations are wrong. Which could be the case but so far there aren't better translations. What you are suggesting is seriously that hygoro threw that information in in spite of it contributing less than nothing to the overall explanation he was making. And it simply doesn't make sense that the explanation ties to haki without it being haki. That's just not how sentences and explanations work. That's how rambling incoherently works.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

It's not that ambiguous unless the translations are wrong. Which could be the case but so far there aren't better translations. What you are suggesting is seriously that hygoro threw that information in in spite of it contributing less than nothing to the overall explanation he was making. And it simply doesn't make sense that the explanation ties to haki without it being haki. That's just not how sentences and explanations work. That's how rambling incoherently works.

Like I said agree to disagree. The end.
Let's not drag on a conversation leading no where.

 

[Hrathgrath]

No science please. Stop making things more complex than they already are.

And what are you getting at here?
Are you talking about black blades or just any weapon infused with Haki?

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 26, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 26, 2019 ---

Then humour me...
Show me one panel where it's specifically said that BOAT IS HAKI.

Cos if you are grabbing at what Hyo said, it can be interpreted in multiple ways.

I don’t see it as more complex. Just an explanation of how it could be working. As for your question, both. Hardening your blades massively with your haki over a great period of time will change the molecular structure of the metal, making it harder permanently. According to my theory of course.

Secondly, anything can be interpreted in different ways, and yes your interpretation is entirely possible. What some of us are saying is that as far as basic sentence structure and conversations regarding explication is concerned, we think the likelihood of him mentioning something that has nothing to do with haki, and then not elaborating on that in any way, is VERY unlikely. In our opinion. I’ll never be the guy to say it’s simply not possible because I don’t have the ego to believe that someone else may understand something (or anything) better than I do. I like to use the analogy “No matter how hard you try, you can’t teach a bird algebra”. He point being, there are things that we, as humans, just cant understand, and there’s nothing wrong with accepting that fact. It may come to pass that everything we think we know about the universe is entirely wrong and our explanations only work from a human perspective. But I digress... lol!